In this episode, we step in with the AI sales tango. Corey, our tree-hugging sales champ, questions if AI can replace good old empathy. Our resident sales physicist, Chris chimes in, revealing AI as your trusty confidant, not a sales rival. Chris dishes out AI secrets: it's an emotional prosthetic, erasing self-doubt and boosting confidence. It's like AI saying, "You've got this!" Corey and Chris tag-team AI's power in sales—providing insights, suggesting next moves, and extinguishing self-doubt. AI's not stealing the spotlight; it's your backup dancer, complementing your sales swagger. They salsa through the AI-human tango, admitting AI won't replace human connection magic. But it's the GPS guiding you through the sales maze. The bottom line? Episode 191 busts the myth: AI isn't your enemy; it's your trusty sidekick on the sales stage. Join us for this episode, “Boosting Your Sales Swagger with AI As Your Backup Dancer." Linked from this episode: Corey Frank on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn Branch 49 ConnectAndSell

In this episode, we step in with the AI sales tango. Corey, our tree-hugging sales champ, questions if AI can replace good old empathy. Our resident sales physicist, Chris chimes in, revealing AI as your trusty confidant, not a sales rival. Chris dishes out AI secrets: it's an emotional prosthetic, erasing self-doubt and boosting confidence. It's like AI saying, "You've got this!" Corey and Chris tag-team AI's power in sales—providing insights, suggesting next moves, and extinguishing self-doubt. AI's not stealing the spotlight; it's your backup dancer, complementing your sales swagger. They salsa through the AI-human tango, admitting AI won't replace human connection magic. But it's the GPS guiding you through the sales maze. The bottom line? Episode 191 busts the myth: AI isn't your enemy; it's your trusty sidekick on the sales stage. Join us for this episode, “Boosting Your Sales Swagger with AI As Your Backup Dancer." Linked from this episode: <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyfrank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Corey Frank on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://branch49.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Branch 49</a> <a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell</a>

EP191: Boosting Your Sales Swagger with AI As Your Backup Dancer

Are you looking to gain a competitive edge in your sales process? Are you interested in understanding what lies deep inside your sales funnel and pipeline to drive more revenue? Then you don't want to miss this episode! Join our Market Dominanc Guys, Chris Beall, and Corey Frank, as they dive deep into the world of sales technology and AI-powered tools. Discover the true advantage of understanding and optimizing the flow rate within your sales projects. Learn why it's essential to focus on time as the denominator when measuring success rather than vanity metrics like conversion rates. They provide valuable insights on discerning whether a tool truly de-risks your sales path and reduces friction or merely adds to your tech stack inventory without tangible results. Explore the fascinating concept of "speed beats free" and why pushing time on the denominator matters more than dream outcomes in sales. Join us for this episode, “AI for Sales? Don’t be ‘Candy Crush’ Complacent

Are you looking to gain a competitive edge in your sales process? Are you interested in understanding what lies deep inside your sales funnel and pipeline to drive more revenue? Then you don't want to miss this episode! Join our Market Dominanc Guys, Chris Beall, and Corey Frank, as they dive deep into the world of sales technology and AI-powered tools. Discover the true advantage of understanding and optimizing the flow rate within your sales projects. Learn why it's essential to focus on time as the denominator when measuring success rather than vanity metrics like conversion rates. They provide valuable insights on discerning whether a tool truly de-risks your sales path and reduces friction or merely adds to your tech stack inventory without tangible results. Explore the fascinating concept of "speed beats free" and why pushing time on the denominator matters more than dream outcomes in sales. Join us for this episode, “AI for Sales? Don’t be ‘Candy Crush’ Complacent

EP190: AI for Sales? Don’t Be Candy Crush Complacent!

Chris Beall and Corey Frank take us on a nostalgic journey through the evolution of sales tech and the intriguing world of AI. They start with a blast from the past, reminiscing about a 1960s AI program called Eliza, which acted as a non-directive therapist, fooling people into thinking it was a friend. Fast forward to the present day, they question the true value of CRM systems, pondering whether they actually help make money or just keep salespeople organized. Corey shares a road trip story of stumbling upon racks of rock salt in Alabama, sparking the idea of the right people selling the right tools. Chris passionately emphasizes that onboarding salespeople should involve engaging them in discovery meetings from day one to boost their success. This episode encourages sales managers and CEOs to rethink their sales tech strategies, focus on revenue-generating activities, and find the perfect balance between the human touch and AI. Join us for “Rock Salt &amp; Roll: Unraveling Sales Tech's Mystery.” Linked from this episode: EP9: How to Harvest Authentic Trust in your Discovery Calls Corey Frank on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn Branch 49 ConnectAndSell

Chris Beall and Corey Frank take us on a nostalgic journey through the evolution of sales tech and the intriguing world of AI. They start with a blast from the past, reminiscing about a 1960s AI program called Eliza, which acted as a non-directive therapist, fooling people into thinking it was a friend. Fast forward to the present day, they question the true value of CRM systems, pondering whether they actually help make money or just keep salespeople organized. Corey shares a road trip story of stumbling upon racks of rock salt in Alabama, sparking the idea of the right people selling the right tools. Chris passionately emphasizes that onboarding salespeople should involve engaging them in discovery meetings from day one to boost their success. This episode encourages sales managers and CEOs to rethink their sales tech strategies, focus on revenue-generating activities, and find the perfect balance between the human touch and AI. Join us for “Rock Salt &amp; Roll: Unraveling Sales Tech's Mystery.” Linked from this episode: <a href="https://marketdominanceguys.com/e/how-to-harvest-authentic-trust-in-your-discovery-calls/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">EP9: How to Harvest Authentic Trust in your Discovery Calls</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyfrank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Corey Frank on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://branch49.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Branch 49</a> <a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell</a>

EP189: Rock Salt & Roll: Unraveling Sales Tech’s Mystery

Chris unravels the enchanting world of manufacturing. Gone are the days of painstakingly crafting artifacts one by one, like our Stone Age ancestors. Now, we're immersed in the art of flow manufacturing, where tanks channel the flow of chemicals, and even discreet manufacturing dances to the rhythm of flow. It's a symphony of efficiency where our sales teams manufacture opportunities, creating the invaluable currency of option value. Chris urges us to view our sales organizations as factories where identifying bottlenecks and maximizing flow rates are the keys to success. In this world, conversion rates become the icing on the cake, but only after we've mastered the flow. Finally, Chris challenges the age-old debate of quality versus quantity and reminds us that we're left with nothing without quantity. Join us for this episode, "Bottlenecks Beware: Flow Rates Coming to Crash the Party!" Links from this episode: Corey Frank on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn Branch 49 ConnectAndSell

Chris unravels the enchanting world of manufacturing. Gone are the days of painstakingly crafting artifacts one by one, like our Stone Age ancestors. Now, we're immersed in the art of flow manufacturing, where tanks channel the flow of chemicals, and even discreet manufacturing dances to the rhythm of flow. It's a symphony of efficiency where our sales teams manufacture opportunities, creating the invaluable currency of option value. Chris urges us to view our sales organizations as factories where identifying bottlenecks and maximizing flow rates are the keys to success. In this world, conversion rates become the icing on the cake, but only after we've mastered the flow. Finally, Chris challenges the age-old debate of quality versus quantity and reminds us that we're left with nothing without quantity. Join us for this episode, "Bottlenecks Beware: Flow Rates Coming to Crash the Party!" Links from this episode: <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyfrank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Corey Frank on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://branch49.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Branch 49</a> <a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell</a>

EP188: Bottlenecks Beware: Flow Rates Coming to Crash the Party!

The game isn't won with the buzzer shot. The game is won by endless hours of preparing for the buzzer shot. Chris and Susan dive deep into the often-overlooked topic of prospecting costs and return on investment (ROI). Chris's passion for the subject shines through as he challenges conventional thinking and emphasizes the importance of time as the ultimate business denominator. He reveals that traditional efficiency metrics like conversion rates and ratios have little to do with business success. Instead, he argues that prospecting is about maximizing the value of every hour and building a robust pipeline. Chris expertly breaks down prospecting ROI, highlighting the investment in time and the need to attribute pipeline growth back to conversations. Throughout the episode, they share pro tips and emphasize the need for a strategic and holistic approach to prospecting beyond research and follow-ups. This engaging discussion is a must-listen for sales professionals looking to unlock the true potential of prospecting and boost their ROI. Join Chris and Susan for this episode, "Prospecting Costs and ROI: Dollars Spent, Dollars Missed." Links from this episode: Susan Finch on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn Funnel Media Group ConnectAndSell

The game isn't won with the buzzer shot. The game is won by endless hours of preparing for the buzzer shot. Chris and Susan dive deep into the often-overlooked topic of prospecting costs and return on investment (ROI). Chris's passion for the subject shines through as he challenges conventional thinking and emphasizes the importance of time as the ultimate business denominator. He reveals that traditional efficiency metrics like conversion rates and ratios have little to do with business success. Instead, he argues that prospecting is about maximizing the value of every hour and building a robust pipeline. Chris expertly breaks down prospecting ROI, highlighting the investment in time and the need to attribute pipeline growth back to conversations. Throughout the episode, they share pro tips and emphasize the need for a strategic and holistic approach to prospecting beyond research and follow-ups. This engaging discussion is a must-listen for sales professionals looking to unlock the true potential of prospecting and boost their ROI. Join Chris and Susan for this episode, "Prospecting Costs and ROI: Dollars Spent, Dollars Missed." Links from this episode: <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanmfinch/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Susan Finch on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://funnelmediagroupllc.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Funnel Media Group</a> <a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell</a>

EP187: Prospecting Costs - Dollars Spent, Dollars Missed

Chris and Corey asked me to prepare you for a mind-expanding journey as we take Dr. Goldratt’s theory of constraints beyond its traditional boundaries and revolutionize the way you approach sales. Discover the art of identifying the true constraint and learn why pulling together as a team can sometimes snap the traces. We uncover the secrets of critical paths, buffers, and the profound impact of time in the fast-paced sales arena. Embrace your inner rebel and challenge the norms by seeking fresh perspectives from other disciplines. But wait, there's more! Get inspired by the legendary story of competitive eater Kobe and his unconventional strategies that shattered records. We'll show you how to think outside the bun and achieve unprecedented sales success. Join us for this episode covering mastering sales success by unleashing the power of constraints and revolutionary strategies but we’ll just call it, “Hot Dogs and Hot Deals: Devouring Sales Records!" Links from this episode: Corey Frank on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn Branch 49 ConnectAndSell

Chris and Corey asked me to prepare you for a mind-expanding journey as we take Dr. Goldratt’s theory of constraints beyond its traditional boundaries and revolutionize the way you approach sales. Discover the art of identifying the true constraint and learn why pulling together as a team can sometimes snap the traces. We uncover the secrets of critical paths, buffers, and the profound impact of time in the fast-paced sales arena. Embrace your inner rebel and challenge the norms by seeking fresh perspectives from other disciplines. But wait, there's more! Get inspired by the legendary story of competitive eater Kobe and his unconventional strategies that shattered records. We'll show you how to think outside the bun and achieve unprecedented sales success. Join us for this episode covering mastering sales success by unleashing the power of constraints and revolutionary strategies but we’ll just call it, “Hot Dogs and Hot Deals: Devouring Sales Records!" Links from this episode: <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyfrank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Corey Frank on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://branch49.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Branch 49</a> <a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell</a>

EP186: Hot Dogs and Hot Deals - Devouring Sales Records

Chris and Corey continue their conversation with Dr. Mindy Weinstein, as they delve deep into the psychology behind scarcity and its profound impact on consumer behavior. You'll uncover invaluable insights on how scarcity appeals to different generations, especially the younger demographic, and how you can leverage this powerful phenomenon to drive sales success. Drawing from their wealth of experience, Corey and Chris share practical strategies on positioning salespeople as indispensable resources in a scarce market, fostering authentic connections, and building trust through genuine expertise. By the end of this episode, you'll be equipped with actionable tips and powerful communication techniques to elevate your sales game and unleash your full potential. Don't miss out on this opportunity to transform your sales approach—tune in now and unlock the untapped potential of scarcity!  Join us for this episode, "Using Scarcity Tactics in Sales: GenX vs. GenZ Psychology." Links from this episode: Dr. Mindy Weinstein on LinkedIn Corey Frank on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn Branch 49 ConnectAndSell

Chris and Corey continue their conversation with Dr. Mindy Weinstein, as they delve deep into the psychology behind scarcity and its profound impact on consumer behavior. You'll uncover invaluable insights on how scarcity appeals to different generations, especially the younger demographic, and how you can leverage this powerful phenomenon to drive sales success. Drawing from their wealth of experience, Corey and Chris share practical strategies on positioning salespeople as indispensable resources in a scarce market, fostering authentic connections, and building trust through genuine expertise. By the end of this episode, you'll be equipped with actionable tips and powerful communication techniques to elevate your sales game and unleash your full potential. Don't miss out on this opportunity to transform your sales approach—tune in now and unlock the untapped potential of scarcity!  Join us for this episode, "Using Scarcity Tactics in Sales: GenX vs. GenZ Psychology." Links from this episode: <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/mindydweinstein/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Dr. Mindy Weinstein on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyfrank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Corey Frank on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://branch49.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Branch 49</a> <a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell</a>

EP185: Using Scarcity Tactics in Sales - GenX vs GenZ Psychology

In this episode Chris and Corey are joined by the brilliant Dr. Mindy Weinstein, marketing expert and author of the bestselling book, "The Power of Scarcity." If you want to boost your sales game, this episode is a must-listen. Dr. Weinstein breaks down the secrets behind scarcity and its four types: time-related, demand-related, supply-related, and limited edition scarcity. Learn how to tap into the psychology of scarcity and motivate your customers to take action. Together, they explore the dynamics of scarcity in business and the impact it has on sales and marketing strategies. They also emphasize the importance of trust and credibility. Don't be that professional who abuses scarcity—build genuine relationships first! Join the Market Dominance Guys for a an insightful exploration of the power of scarcity in sales, in "Cracking the Code: Scarcity Strategies for Sales Success."   About Dr. Mindy Weinstein Marketing is her passion. Over the last several years, she has trained 15,000+ people how to effectively approach marketing and sales in today's climate. Through webinars, workshops and conferences, her goal is to educate the business world one person at a time. As part of this goal, she has been researching, teaching and consulting about marketing psychology, with a special focus on the power of scarcity. In fact, that’s the name of her bestselling book, The Power of Scarcity: Leveraging Urgency and Demand to Influence Customer Decisions (McGraw Hill 2022). Links from this episode:  Dr. Mindy Weinstein on LinkedIn Corey Frank on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn Branch 49 ConnectAndSell

In this episode Chris and Corey are joined by the brilliant Dr. Mindy Weinstein, marketing expert and author of the bestselling book, "The Power of Scarcity." If you want to boost your sales game, this episode is a must-listen. Dr. Weinstein breaks down the secrets behind scarcity and its four types: time-related, demand-related, supply-related, and limited edition scarcity. Learn how to tap into the psychology of scarcity and motivate your customers to take action. Together, they explore the dynamics of scarcity in business and the impact it has on sales and marketing strategies. They also emphasize the importance of trust and credibility. Don't be that professional who abuses scarcity—build genuine relationships first! Join the Market Dominance Guys for a an insightful exploration of the power of scarcity in sales, in "Cracking the Code: Scarcity Strategies for Sales Success." About Dr. Mindy Weinstein Marketing is her passion. Over the last several years, she has trained 15,000+ people how to effectively approach marketing and sales in today's climate. Through webinars, workshops and conferences, her goal is to educate the business world one person at a time. As part of this goal, she has been researching, teaching and consulting about marketing psychology, with a special focus on the power of scarcity. In fact, that’s the name of her bestselling book, <a href="https://amazon.com/Power-Scarcity-Leveraging-Influence-Decisions/dp/1264278233" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">The Power of Scarcity: Leveraging Urgency and Demand to Influence Customer Decisions</a> (McGraw Hill 2022). Links from this episode: <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/mindydweinstein/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"> Dr. Mindy Weinstein on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyfrank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Corey Frank on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://branch49.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Branch 49</a> <a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell</a>

EP184: Cracking the Code; Scarcity Strategies for Sales Success

Chris and Corey continue their conversation with Ben Sternsmith of Sybill AI . This episode covers how AI is revolutionizing the sales process, making it more precise and empowering for sales professionals. Discover how AI analyzes tonality and body language, equipping salespeople with unparalleled accuracy in assessing deal progress. They discuss the importance of building trust with clients and how AI can support but never replace the human touch in establishing meaningful connections. They also explore the resurgence of cold calling as a powerful strategy in the digital age and introduce Dealy. This innovative AI-driven solution enhances CRM systems by analyzing customer interactions and providing valuable insights. Join us for this insightful episode that explores the synergy between sales and AI, offering practical tips and inspiring ideas for sales professionals.   Links from this episode: Ben Sternsmith on LinkedIn Corey Frank on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn  Sybill AI Branch 49 ConnectAndSell About Sybill AI Sybill AI is an AI company that originated as a Stanford project three years ago. The founders, frustrated with the limitations of remote teaching, developed a behavioral AI engine over Zoom. This innovative tool records calls and analyzes body language to determine engagement levels. Leveraging the power of large language models like GPT-4, Sybill AI offers generative AI for salespeople. It automatically generates call summaries, writes AI-powered follow-up emails, and even appends CRM data.

Chris and Corey continue their conversation with Ben Sternsmith of Sybill AI . This episode covers how AI is revolutionizing the sales process, making it more precise and empowering for sales professionals. Discover how AI analyzes tonality and body language, equipping salespeople with unparalleled accuracy in assessing deal progress. They discuss the importance of building trust with clients and how AI can support but never replace the human touch in establishing meaningful connections. They also explore the resurgence of cold calling as a powerful strategy in the digital age and introduce Dealy. This innovative AI-driven solution enhances CRM systems by analyzing customer interactions and providing valuable insights. Join us for this insightful episode that explores the synergy between sales and AI, offering practical tips and inspiring ideas for sales professionals. Links from this episode: <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/sternsmith/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Ben Sternsmith on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyfrank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Corey Frank on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://sybill.ai/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Sybill AI</a> <a href="https://branch49.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Branch 49</a> C<a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">onnectAndSell</a> About Sybill AI Sybill AI is an AI company that originated as a Stanford project three years ago. The founders, frustrated with the limitations of remote teaching, developed a behavioral AI engine over Zoom. This innovative tool records calls and analyzes body language to determine engagement levels. Leveraging the power of large language models like GPT-4, Sybill AI offers generative AI for salespeople. It automatically generates call summaries, writes AI-powered follow-up emails, and even appends CRM data.

EP183: Sales Mastery - Body Language and AI Giving You the Edge

The guys welcome Ben Sternsmith of Sybill AI delves into the benefits of AI in sales, such as freeing salespeople to be more engaged and focused during customer interactions. Ben shares his experience of being able to concentrate on customer needs without the burden of note-taking or manual follow-up tasks. As Corey, Chris, and Ben explore the possibilities opened up by AI in sales, they discuss the challenges faced by sales professionals and the potential for AI tools to streamline and enhance their work. With tools like Sybill AI and ConnectAndSell, sales reps can offload repetitive tasks and focus on building genuine connections with customers. Join Corey, Chris, and Ben on this captivating episode as they unravel the fascinating world of AI in sales and its potential to reshape the industry in this episode, “Harnessing Generative AI: Revolutionizing Sales Strategies and Results”. Links from this episode: Ben Sternsmith on LinkedIn Corey Frank on LinkedIn Chris Beall on LinkedIn  Sybill AI Branch 49 ConnectAndSell About Sybill AI Sybill AI is an AI company that originated as a Stanford project three years ago. The founders, frustrated with the limitations of remote teaching, developed a behavioral AI engine over Zoom. This innovative tool records calls and analyzes body language to determine engagement levels. Leveraging the power of large language models like GPT-4, Sybill AI offers generative AI for salespeople. It automatically generates call summaries, writes AI-powered follow-up emails, and even appends CRM data.

The guys welcome Ben Sternsmith of Sybill AI delves into the benefits of AI in sales, such as freeing salespeople to be more engaged and focused during customer interactions. Ben shares his experience of being able to concentrate on customer needs without the burden of note-taking or manual follow-up tasks. As Corey, Chris, and Ben explore the possibilities opened up by AI in sales, they discuss the challenges faced by sales professionals and the potential for AI tools to streamline and enhance their work. With tools like Sybill AI and ConnectAndSell, sales reps can offload repetitive tasks and focus on building genuine connections with customers. Join Corey, Chris, and Ben on this captivating episode as they unravel the fascinating world of AI in sales and its potential to reshape the industry in this episode, “Harnessing Generative AI: Revolutionizing Sales Strategies and Results”. Links from this episode: <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/sternsmith/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Ben Sternsmith on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyfrank/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Corey Frank on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-beall-7859a4/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Chris Beall on LinkedIn</a> <a href="https://sybill.ai" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Sybill AI</a> <a href="https://branch49.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Branch 49</a> C<a href="https://connectandsell.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">onnectAndSell</a> About Sybill AI Sybill AI is an AI company that originated as a Stanford project three years ago. The founders, frustrated with the limitations of remote teaching, developed a behavioral AI engine over Zoom. This innovative tool records calls and analyzes body language to determine engagement levels. Leveraging the power of large language models like GPT-4, Sybill AI offers generative AI for salespeople. It automatically generates call summaries, writes AI-powered follow-up emails, and even appends CRM data.

EP182: Harnessing Generative AI: Revolutionizing Sales Strategies and Results

Chris Beall and Corey Frank host episodes with thought leadership that leaves you shaking inside.

As someone learning sales, this podcast is one of my go-tos when learning about advanced methods for overcoming rejections, tools, and the mindset needed to success in business.

Great Podcast for beginners and experts

Solid content!

Market Dominance Guys

EP8: How to Free Solo Your Pitch

What do you need to believe when you ask someone for 15 minutes of their time? What’s the underlying emotional and rational DNA of true belief that is pulsing through your brain? And even beyond this, it would be helpful to remind our listeners about our mission here at the Market Dominance Guys…what’s the real reason these nuances and steps and tactics of market dominance even matter? Because, after all, if we don't get past the discovery step consistently we can never dominate our market. So all of these steps are not necessarily put in place for the salesperson themselves to be successful, although that is great byproduct; The real underlying purpose of all of this is to provide an alternative or an adjunct to the traditional funding, mergers, and acquisitions as a way of executing corporate strategy …That’s actually the purpose of all this…as my esteemed and candid co-host is very fond of saying, “You can go sell any damn way you want…if you DON’T want to dominate markets. Why? No one will care.”   In this episode, I poke Chris into a controlled burn on the mathematics, the reasoning, and the basic economics of how to dominate your market…and why it matters even more in today’s booming economy.  This is “No Tourists Allowed: Are You Serious about Reaching the top of your Market.”  ----more---- ConnectAndSell. Welcome to the end of dialing as you know it! ConnectAndSell allows your sales reps to talk to more decision-makers in 90 minutes than they would in a week or more of conventional dialing. Your reps can finally be 100% focused on selling since all of their CRM data entry and follow-up scheduling is fully automated within ConnectAndSell’s powerful platform. Your team’s effectiveness will skyrocket by using ConnectAndSell’s teleprompter capability as they’ll know exactly what to say during critical conversations. So come on… give your fingers a rest with ConnectAndSell! Visit, ConnectAndSell.com Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with

What do you need to believe when you ask someone for 15 minutes of their time? What’s the underlying emotional and rational DNA of true belief that is pulsing through your brain? And even beyond this, it would be helpful to remind our listeners about our mission here at the Market Dominance Guys…what’s the real reason these nuances and steps and tactics of market dominance even matter? Because, after all, if we don't get past the discovery step consistently we can never dominate our market. So all of these steps are not necessarily put in place for the salesperson themselves to be successful, although that is great byproduct; The real underlying purpose of all of this is to provide an alternative or an adjunct to the traditional funding, mergers, and acquisitions as a way of executing corporate strategy …That’s actually the purpose of all this…as my esteemed and candid co-host is very fond of saying, “You can go sell any damn way you want…if you DON’T want to dominate markets. Why? No one will care.”   In this episode, I poke Chris into a controlled burn on the mathematics, the reasoning, and the basic economics of how to dominate your market…and why it matters even more in today’s booming economy.  This is “No Tourists Allowed: Are You Serious about Reaching the top of your Market.”  ----more---- ConnectAndSell. Welcome to the end of dialing as you know it! ConnectAndSell allows your sales reps to talk to more decision-makers in 90 minutes than they would in a week or more of conventional dialing. Your reps can finally be 100% focused on selling since all of their CRM data entry and follow-up scheduling is fully automated within ConnectAndSell’s powerful platform. Your team’s effectiveness will skyrocket by using ConnectAndSell’s teleprompter capability as they’ll know exactly what to say during critical conversations. So come on… give your fingers a rest with ConnectAndSell! Visit, <a href="https://ConnectAndSell.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell.com</a> Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with

EP10: Are You Serious About Reaching the Top of Your Market?

EP22: The Rise and Fall of the Sales Empire

Growing up, your mom probably told you to never talk to strangers. She also said never ask anyone for money. So…fast forward 20 years and find yourself at your desk, a newly minted college grad and a fresh-faced and newly hired sales professional at a great company. And what does your boss tell you to do on your first day? “Um…Josh, I need you to take this list of leads and I need you to call them (i.e. talk to strangers)…oh and then, if they’re really friendly, I need you to ask them to buy something (i.e. ask them for money…or even tougher, ask them for time).  Um...ok?” So how do you step up and actually tackle these taboos and address the social baggage that we all have been taught? How do you reduce fear and build trust…especially since you are even worse than a typical stranger…you are an invisible stranger! In this episode, Chris and I have a little fun in this episode of Market Dominance Guys and discuss “Stranger” Things.  ----more---- ConnectAndSell – Welcome to the end of dialing as you know it! ConnectAndSell’s Patented Technology loads your Best Sales folks up with 8-10x more Live qualified Conversations every day….and when we say qualified, we’re talking about really Qualified…like knowing what kind of cheese they like on their impossible whopper - kind of qualified. Learn more at ConnectAndSell.com Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with uncommonpro.com. The complete transcript of this episode is below:Chris Beall (02:06): In cold calling is "how do you step up"? And it turns out there was a very powerful way to do it, which is to break the taboo against being the problem and be straight up, just admit, in fact, proactively declaim, you are the problem. I know I'm an interruption. And that's why the phrase is said like that. I know I'm an interruption. I agree with you. You know, I'm an interruption. I don't have to tell you that, but I'm telling you, I know I'm an interruption. So not only have I broken the taboo, which gets everybody's attention, right? It's like blood, it gets everybody's attention. You can't open a cold call with blood and that one doesn't work. And you could, somebody answers the phone. You say: "Hey, Corey, you know, I've got a lot of blood right here. That's kind of pouring out of this side of my arm." Chris Beall (02:54): You'd probably go: "Oh my God, I might get your attention. But I think it might be a little difficult to the conversation." But if I say: "I know I'm an interruption and I break that taboo against being the problem." Then suddenly you've got to deal with the fact that I've done that. And this is by the way, how I was successful as a brush man in Phoenix. I would knock on the door and imagine your kid has never sold in his life. You're selling under pressure, real pressure. I've got to make money in order to deal with the financial consequences of a miscarriage said, miscarriage, by the way happened, just on the other side of this counter, in the middle of that kitchen, that's 10 feet away from me. It happened. And guess what it was: it was pool of blood on the floor. Chris Beall (03:41): So, I mean, imagine a pool of blood spreading across the floor, underneath my wife. So that's how, that's what I came to as this miscarriage is watching somebody in her, in her house, coat standing in a pool of blood. Right? So now I've got to deal with this and we're about to move the next day. We're going to move to Colorado. Well, now I can't move to Colorado. There was a hospital visit. There's... Corey Frank  (04:07): And you're selling Fuller brushes? Chris Beall (04:08): And not, yet, I'm moving and now I need a job and I need a job in one day. And the only job I could find in one day was to be a Fuller-brush-man. And I met the Fuller-brush people at Denny's, the boss, you know, the district manager or whatever he was. And the training was almost non-existent. It's like: "here's the bag? Chris Beall (04:31): Here's the stuff. Here's what you do. Here's how you fill out the order, your territory dude go." Right? So I thought about it and I said: "Hey, this is what they said to do is knock on the door and then try to sell them something." And I thought that's impossible. Chris Beall (04:44): Why would somebody buy something from a stranger knocking on their door when it's 114 degrees out? That's just nutty. They have a perfect excuse to close the door, you're costing me a dollar, a minute of air conditioning. "Thank you very much goodbye." Chris Beall (04:58): So I thought, you know, typical of my approach to things as a physicist mathematician: is to break it down into the pieces and then ask which piece can I do? So the piece I realized I could do was this: I would knock on the door and I thought, what I need is information and permission to come back. Chris Beall (05:15): Those are the two things I need. I need to know who I'm dealing with. I need to have them tell me I can come back. So I can't sell them. So when I'm selling them, I'm selling them the opportunity to learn something about them, which I can do just by looking at them. Okay? Chris Beall (05:29): So I got to get a look at them and then I need to get permission to come back; so that's my sale. Can I come back? So the way I did it was this: I broke a taboo and knocked on the door. They would answer, I said: "Hi, I'm Chris Beall I'm your new Fuller-brush-man. You probably don't know what Fuller-brush is, I sure don’t." Huge taboo, Right? I'm ignorant of my own company. That's like a crazy thing to say. A hundred percent of the time people kept the door open. There wasn't one person who closed the door in my face. I don't even think my mother would've done. And she was an expert, she was like, God of closing the door. Chris Beall (06:11): So, then they would say, how can I help you? That's what everybody said: "How can I help you?". Because I had said that I was vulnerable because I didn't even know what my company was. And so they asked for the opportunity to help me. And I said: "Well, here's what would be really helpful for me. I've heard, and I don't know if this is true, that our company has some products that can't be bought in stores and that are unusually good around the house". Chris Beall (06:41): And what I would like to do is to go look at those products, which I haven't had a chance to look at, at all yet. And if I find one or two of these that I think would really make a difference in your life, do I have your permission to come back in and waste five minutes of your time showing them to every single person I talked to said, yes, there were no exceptions. So I had a door to close rate in my first week here, my territory of 100%. And now I had information. So it was a woman 30 to 40. Obviously had some kids. There's an oil stain on the driveway. Hey, they have a garage, it's Arizona and know that they have black widow spiders in there, and I know how to find them because I grew up here. Then I went off, you know, I took my notes on each one and went to the next door and, and did this and did this and did this. Chris Beall (07:31): And it took five days to do my whole territory. I was very efficient because I didn't have to waste any time selling them anything. It was just this one thing. It took less than two minutes. It was done. I'd watch, take my notes fast blocks with they do the next door, compose myself a little bit, and then knock on that door and just repeat the same thing. Now I got all this information and I went and found, I figured out there were seven demographics that were significant. And I found a person that I knew in each demographic. And I went through the catalog very quickly category by category and found two products for that demographic that that person told me that they would buy. One was very inexpensive and it was something you would only ever need one of in your life. Chris Beall (08:12): So you would buy it from me unless you hated me. And then the other one was something that was relatively expensive consumable, and that if you wanted it and you thought it was never coming back, you'd buy a lock. That was that two products. So 14 products. I sold that of the thousands in catalog. And then I just went back in the evening when people were a little more relaxed, it's not quite so hot, sun's just gone down. So it took me twice as long to go through the territory. And I shared those two products and I always made sure it was only five minutes and everybody except for 6%. So 94% bought something from me and other 72%, bought at least $30 of the thing that you wouldn't be able to get again. And some would buy a hundred dollars plus, and one in 10 would buy my electrostatic-force-sweeper. Cause my mom liked it. Chris Beall (09:06): And I became the number one Fuller-brush-man in Arizona history, I believe in two weeks. By doing something very simple, by breaking the taboo of ignorance of what you're selling by not posing as the product expert, but by being vulnerable. And then them offering me help and me doing a service for them, which is researching the products and then keeping my promise, which was five minutes. Corey Frank  (09:32): So, but everything else that you read, it seems as about establishing star power, credibility, respect; that you know, your product. And I almost hear you saying Chris, that vulnerability supersedes that, it it's a, it's a super highway to trust because the reaction that your prospects had said to you after you showed vulnerability, you probably physically threw up your arm. Corey Frank  (10:05): So I don't know anything about right. And so just the mythological statement of having [inaudible 00:10:12] being vulnerable led to them saying, well, how can I help you? You've given, you've opened up. You know, let me, let me see. I can, how I can help you. And is, or, or is it, is it a temporary condition? Is it a parallel condition? Does it, is it like the word blood where vulnerability shocks people into wanting to render assistance and, now you're in the trust circle. If you will? Where they're going to be listening a little bit more intently because they're not going to have their hand on their wallet or their hand on their holster because you've already kind of bypassed that, that emotion. That's what I hear you saying. But,... Chris Beall (10:59): And it's very powerful because it's universal. We're not pulling a trick on them. You're actually telling them the truth, that's what's especially interesting. Chris Beall (11:07): In the cold call, when you say, I know I'm an interruption, you're not saying, I know I'm interrupting you. I know I'm interrupting your day is not interesting. It's not about me. I want to tell you that I'm the problem. And then, cause you think I'm the problem. The circumstance is not the problem. We can't throw the circumstance under the bus, but we can throw me under the bus and that's it. There's subtlety in here. This is why this is so hard to teach and so hard to learn because taboos are very, very hard to break. And we drift away from breaking the taboo to the non-taboo version, which doesn't work at all. By the way, it has no effect. When I say, if I were to say know, I'm interrupting your day, I get nothing. If I say, I know I'm an interruption and I emphasize the word, no, then I get something. And what I get is you're listening to the person who just said he was an interruption. Why did he say what was an interruption? Chris Beall (12:11): I mean, I know I agree with you, right? But nobody ever, nobody ever admits that and it doesn't go. It doesn't go stale at some point you only have to use it once or only that person once. Corey Frank  (12:24): Versus, "Hey, did I catch you at a good time to catch you at a bad time? Do you have five minutes to talk? Can you have 15 minutes? Maybe I can get in your calendar?" Too soon and no trust and no empathy. Chris Beall (12:35): Yes. And it's only four words: I know I'm an interruption. It's Five words after which you get to offer a solution to the problem after all, why would I tell you about a problem that I believe you have? Chris Beall (12:50): Which, happens to be me unless I'm going to offer a solution to the problem. So if I just called you up and said, I know I'm an interruption and just stopped after a while, you'd be thinking, yeah. "Okay. Like, what's next?" What if I say: "I know I'm an interruption." And then I changed my voice to playful and curious, and I offer a solution. So I'm going to change the mood here from an acknowledgment of flat, very flat acknowledgment of a fact, which is, I am the problem to a question which is basically: "might we play together for a little bit of time?" Chris Beall (13:38): Can you, will you come out and play? So now we're back to knocking on the door; "Hey, can Corey come out and play? Mrs. Frank, can Corey come out and play?" That's that voice, right? You wouldn't say: "Hey, Mrs. Frank, can Corey come out and play?", that would be ridiculous. Right? Corey Frank  (13:56): Yeah. Chris Beall (13:56): You have to say it in playful curious. And it has to be that knows Okay. "No, sorry. Corey is doing his homework right now and he's a little bit behind in school. He's not the quickest kid in the entire place. And he has to do the extra work. Sorry. He can't come out and play" Chris Beall (14:11): Right? You have to let Mrs. Frank say whatever she's going to say. And that's who you're asking. Actually you're asking their parents if they can come out and play. So that is, it's interesting to them that the solution to the problem might be as simple as coming up and playing for 27 seconds and they don't have to do anything. They just have to listen. Chris Beall (14:32): So, when you asked the question, you're actually asking a funny question. You're not asking permission. People often say to me: "Oh, so then you ask for permission to talk." Chris Beall (14:42): That's not what you're asking at all. You're asking about a circumstance, which only they can know about. And you're doing it in a way that you're presenting a plan to solve, to solve the problem. So you're showing that you're competent to solve a problem they have right now, The problem is: you. Chris Beall (15:02): So you offer a solution to the problem in a classic way. That's been heard thousands of times, which is:" can you come out and play?" That is:"are you free for a moment? Can I have 27 seconds?" So at that point I've shown vulnerability. I know you want to help me at that point, by the way your inclination is to help me. So I'm going to give you a program where you can help me. Can I have? "You're going to give me something: 27 seconds." Chris Beall (15:30): That's funny, that's playful. For purpose to tell you why I called; can I have 27 seconds to tell you why I called? Chris Beall (15:37): And that voice, which has got a little up rollercoaster is not a standard question. It's not a question of the sort like where you would answer:"Yes I have a bag of coffee; no, the dog is sick." Chris Beall (15:52): It's none of that, it's a question of, are you willing to come out and play with me for 27 seconds in order to solve a problem that I know that you have, which is that I'm an interruption

Growing up, your mom probably told you to never talk to strangers. She also said never ask anyone for money. So…fast forward 20 years and find yourself at your desk, a newly minted college grad and a fresh-faced and newly hired sales professional at a great company. And what does your boss tell you to do on your first day? “Um…Josh, I need you to take this list of leads and I need you to call them (i.e. talk to strangers)…oh and then, if they’re really friendly, I need you to ask them to buy something (i.e. ask them for money…or even tougher, ask them for time).  Um...ok?” So how do you step up and actually tackle these taboos and address the social baggage that we all have been taught? How do you reduce fear and build trust…especially since you are even worse than a typical stranger…you are an invisible stranger! In this episode, Chris and I have a little fun in this episode of Market Dominance Guys and discuss “Stranger” Things.  ----more---- ConnectAndSell – Welcome to the end of dialing as you know it! ConnectAndSell’s Patented Technology loads your Best Sales folks up with 8-10x more Live qualified Conversations every day….and when we say qualified, we’re talking about really Qualified…like knowing what kind of cheese they like on their impossible whopper - kind of qualified. Learn more at <a href="https://ConnectAndSell.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell.com</a> Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with <a href="https://uncommonpro.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">uncommonpro.com</a>. The complete transcript of this episode is below: Chris Beall (02:06): In cold calling is "how do you step up"? And it turns out there was a very powerful way to do it, which is to break the taboo against being the problem and be straight up, just admit, in fact, proactively declaim, you are the problem. I know I'm an interruption. And that's why the phrase is said like that. I know I'm an interruption. I agree with you. You know, I'm an interruption. I don't have to tell you that, but I'm telling you, I know I'm an interruption. So not only have I broken the taboo, which gets everybody's attention, right? It's like blood, it gets everybody's attention. You can't open a cold call with blood and that one doesn't work. And you could, somebody answers the phone. You say: "Hey, Corey, you know, I've got a lot of blood right here. That's kind of pouring out of this side of my arm." Chris Beall (02:54): You'd probably go: "Oh my God, I might get your attention. But I think it might be a little difficult to the conversation." But if I say: "I know I'm an interruption and I break that taboo against being the problem." Then suddenly you've got to deal with the fact that I've done that. And this is by the way, how I was successful as a brush man in Phoenix. I would knock on the door and imagine your kid has never sold in his life. You're selling under pressure, real pressure. I've got to make money in order to deal with the financial consequences of a miscarriage said, miscarriage, by the way happened, just on the other side of this counter, in the middle of that kitchen, that's 10 feet away from me. It happened. And guess what it was: it was pool of blood on the floor. Chris Beall (03:41): So, I mean, imagine a pool of blood spreading across the floor, underneath my wife. So that's how, that's what I came to as this miscarriage is watching somebody in her, in her house, coat standing in a pool of blood. Right? So now I've got to deal with this and we're about to move the next day. We're going to move to Colorado. Well, now I can't move to Colorado. There was a hospital visit. There's... Corey Frank  (04:07): And you're selling Fuller brushes? Chris Beall (04:08): And not, yet, I'm moving and now I need a job and I need a job in one day. And the only job I could find in one day was to be a Fuller-brush-man. And I met the Fuller-brush people at Denny's, the boss, you know, the district manager or whatever he was. And the training was almost non-existent. It's like: "here's the bag? Chris Beall (04:31): Here's the stuff. Here's what you do. Here's how you fill out the order, your territory dude go." Right? So I thought about it and I said: "Hey, this is what they said to do is knock on the door and then try to sell them something." And I thought that's impossible. Chris Beall (04:44): Why would somebody buy something from a stranger knocking on their door when it's 114 degrees out? That's just nutty. They have a perfect excuse to close the door, you're costing me a dollar, a minute of air conditioning. "Thank you very much goodbye." Chris Beall (04:58): So I thought, you know, typical of my approach to things as a physicist mathematician: is to break it down into the pieces and then ask which piece can I do? So the piece I realized I could do was this: I would knock on the door and I thought, what I need is information and permission to come back. Chris Beall (05:15): Those are the two things I need. I need to know who I'm dealing with. I need to have them tell me I can come back. So I can't sell them. So when I'm selling them, I'm selling them the opportunity to learn something about them, which I can do just by looking at them. Okay? Chris Beall (05:29): So I got to get a look at them and then I need to get permission to come back; so that's my sale. Can I come back? So the way I did it was this: I broke a taboo and knocked on the door. They would answer, I said: "Hi, I'm Chris Beall I'm your new Fuller-brush-man. You probably don't know what Fuller-brush is, I sure don’t." Huge taboo, Right? I'm ignorant of my own company. That's like a crazy thing to say. A hundred percent of the time people kept the door open. There wasn't one person who closed the door in my face. I don't even think my mother would've done. And she was an expert, she was like, God of closing the door. Chris Beall (06:11): So, then they would say, how can I help you? That's what everybody said: "How can I help you?". Because I had said that I was vulnerable because I didn't even know what my company was. And so they asked for the opportunity to help me. And I said: "Well, here's what would be really helpful for me. I've heard, and I don't know if this is true, that our company has some products that can't be bought in stores and that are unusually good around the house". Chris Beall (06:41): And what I would like to do is to go look at those products, which I haven't had a chance to look at, at all yet. And if I find one or two of these that I think would really make a difference in your life, do I have your permission to come back in and waste five minutes of your time showing them to every single person I talked to said, yes, there were no exceptions. So I had a door to close rate in my first week here, my territory of 100%. And now I had information. So it was a woman 30 to 40. Obviously had some kids. There's an oil stain on the driveway. Hey, they have a garage, it's Arizona and know that they have black widow spiders in there, and I know how to find them because I grew up here. Then I went off, you know, I took my notes on each one and went to the next door and, and did this and did this and did this. Chris Beall (07:31): And it took five days to do my whole territory. I was very efficient because I didn't have to waste any time selling them anything. It was just this one thing. It took less than two minutes. It was done. I'd watch, take my notes fast blocks with they do the next door, compose myself a little bit, and then knock on that door and just repeat the same thing. Now I got all this information and I went and found, I figured out there were seven demographics that were significant. And I found a person that I knew in each demographic. And I went through the catalog very quickly category by category and found two products for that demographic that that person told me that they would buy. One was very inexpensive and it was something you would only ever need one of in your life. Chris Beall (08:12): So you would buy it from me unless you hated me. And then the other one was something that was relatively expensive consumable, and that if you wanted it and you thought it was never coming back, you'd buy a lock. That was that two products. So 14 products. I sold that of the thousands in catalog. And then I just went back in the evening when people were a little more relaxed, it's not quite so hot, sun's just gone down. So it took me twice as long to go through the territory. And I shared those two products and I always made sure it was only five minutes and everybody except for 6%. So 94% bought something from me and other 72%, bought at least $30 of the thing that you wouldn't be able to get again. And some would buy a hundred dollars plus, and one in 10 would buy my electrostatic-force-sweeper. Cause my mom liked it. Chris Beall (09:06): And I became the number one Fuller-brush-man in Arizona history, I believe in two weeks. By doing something very simple, by breaking the taboo of ignorance of what you're selling by not posing as the product expert, but by being vulnerable. And then them offering me help and me doing a service for them, which is researching the products and then keeping my promise, which was five minutes. Corey Frank  (09:32): So, but everything else that you read, it seems as about establishing star power, credibility, respect; that you know, your product. And I almost hear you saying Chris, that vulnerability supersedes that, it it's a, it's a super highway to trust because the reaction that your prospects had said to you after you showed vulnerability, you probably physically threw up your arm. Corey Frank  (10:05): So I don't know anything about right. And so just the mythological statement of having [inaudible 00:10:12] being vulnerable led to them saying, well, how can I help you? You've given, you've opened up. You know, let me, let me see. I can, how I can help you. And is, or, or is it, is it a temporary condition? Is it a parallel condition? Does it, is it like the word blood where vulnerability shocks people into wanting to render assistance and, now you're in the trust circle. If you will? Where they're going to be listening a little bit more intently because they're not going to have their hand on their wallet or their hand on their holster because you've already kind of bypassed that, that emotion. That's what I hear you saying. But,... Chris Beall (10:59): And it's very powerful because it's universal. We're not pulling a trick on them. You're actually telling them the truth, that's what's especially interesting. Chris Beall (11:07): In the cold call, when you say, I know I'm an interruption, you're not saying, I know I'm interrupting you. I know I'm interrupting your day is not interesting. It's not about me. I want to tell you that I'm the problem. And then, cause you think I'm the problem. The circumstance is not the problem. We can't throw the circumstance under the bus, but we can throw me under the bus and that's it. There's subtlety in here. This is why this is so hard to teach and so hard to learn because taboos are very, very hard to break. And we drift away from breaking the taboo to the non-taboo version, which doesn't work at all. By the way, it has no effect. When I say, if I were to say know, I'm interrupting your day, I get nothing. If I say, I know I'm an interruption and I emphasize the word, no, then I get something. And what I get is you're listening to the person who just said he was an interruption. Why did he say what was an interruption? Chris Beall (12:11): I mean, I know I agree with you, right? But nobody ever, nobody ever admits that and it doesn't go. It doesn't go stale at some point you only have to use it once or only that person once. Corey Frank  (12:24): Versus, "Hey, did I catch you at a good time to catch you at a bad time? Do you have five minutes to talk? Can you have 15 minutes? Maybe I can get in your calendar?" Too soon and no trust and no empathy. Chris Beall (12:35): Yes. And it's only four words: I know I'm an interruption. It's Five words after which you get to offer a solution to the problem after all, why would I tell you about a problem that I believe you have? Chris Beall (12:50): Which, happens to be me unless I'm going to offer a solution to the problem. So if I just called you up and said, I know I'm an interruption and just stopped after a while, you'd be thinking, yeah. "Okay. Like, what's next?" What if I say: "I know I'm an interruption." And then I changed my voice to playful and curious, and I offer a solution. So I'm going to change the mood here from an acknowledgment of flat, very flat acknowledgment of a fact, which is, I am the problem to a question which is basically: "might we play together for a little bit of time?" Chris Beall (13:38): Can you, will you come out and play? So now we're back to knocking on the door; "Hey, can Corey come out and play? Mrs. Frank, can Corey come out and play?" That's that voice, right? You wouldn't say: "Hey, Mrs. Frank, can Corey come out and play?", that would be ridiculous. Right? Corey Frank  (13:56): Yeah. Chris Beall (13:56): You have to say it in playful curious. And it has to be that knows Okay. "No, sorry. Corey is doing his homework right now and he's a little bit behind in school. He's not the quickest kid in the entire place. And he has to do the extra work. Sorry. He can't come out and play" Chris Beall (14:11): Right? You have to let Mrs. Frank say whatever she's going to say. And that's who you're asking. Actually you're asking their parents if they can come out and play. So that is, it's interesting to them that the solution to the problem might be as simple as coming up and playing for 27 seconds and they don't have to do anything. They just have to listen. Chris Beall (14:32): So, when you asked the question, you're actually asking a funny question. You're not asking permission. People often say to me: "Oh, so then you ask for permission to talk." Chris Beall (14:42): That's not what you're asking at all. You're asking about a circumstance, which only they can know about. And you're doing it in a way that you're presenting a plan to solve, to solve the problem. So you're showing that you're competent to solve a problem they have right now, The problem is: you. Chris Beall (15:02): So you offer a solution to the problem in a classic way. That's been heard thousands of times, which is:" can you come out and play?" That is:"are you free for a moment? Can I have 27 seconds?" So at that point I've shown vulnerability. I know you want to help me at that point, by the way your inclination is to help me. So I'm going to give you a program where you can help me. Can I have? "You're going to give me something: 27 seconds." Chris Beall (15:30): That's funny, that's playful. For purpose to tell you why I called; can I have 27 seconds to tell you why I called? Chris Beall (15:37): And that voice, which has got a little up rollercoaster is not a standard question. It's not a question of the sort like where you would answer:"Yes I have a bag of coffee; no, the dog is sick." Chris Beall (15:52): It's none of that, it's a question of, are you willing to come out and play with me for 27 seconds in order to solve a problem that I know that you have, which is that I'm an interruption

EP6: Stranger Things in Sales

EP16: How Many SDRs Does It Take to Change a Lightbulb?

EP9: How to Harvest Authentic Trust in your Discovery Calls

EP25: Three Reasons Sales Reps Don‘t Follow Up

There is a universal product that every company has that it needs to better understand and sell more effectively and correctly. And it's a product that can be crafted and messaged just like any other product your team sells. Because it’s a real product, it requires belief in its potential value and worth from the folks that sell it. It’s a product that shouldn’t be short-cut or mis-messaged…or even try to do too much. It needs to be measured for effectiveness. And the ability to get this product in front of your list is also one of the keys to market dominance. That product is the Discovery Meeting or Discovery Call. In the episode, I ask Chris to separate fact from fiction and put some sound data and reasoning behind this misunderstood and much-maligned tool. This episode of Market Dominance Guys is The Right Tool for the Right Job, or as I like to call it, Don’t Make the Spiders Angry. ----more---- ConnectAndSell. ConnectAndSell allows your sales reps to talk to more decision-makers in 90 minutes than they would in a week or more of conventional dialing. Your reps can finally be 100% focused on selling since all of their CRM data entry and follow-up scheduling is fully automated within ConnectAndSell’s powerful platform. Your team’s effectiveness will skyrocket by using ConnectAndSell’s teleprompter capability as they’ll know exactly what to say during critical conversations. Visit, ConnectAndSell.com Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with uncommonpro.com. The complete transcript of this episode is below:Chris Beall (02:11): It's subtle as can be, and when people want to change it, it's really fun to listen to them because they want to change it to eliminate the taboos. They want to run from the taboos into the conventional, where they can ask some normal questions. Did I catch you at a bad time? All those kinds of questions feel... Corey Frank (02:32): Why is that, Chris? They don't want to express vulnerability, they have an inner governor that says, I don't feel confident enough, vulnerable enough, to go there. And so, it's really on them, not necessarily, they're not ready emotionally to commit themselves to that level of vulnerability in our profession. Chris Beall (02:58): Yes. And [inaudible 00:03:01] puts it perfectly, which is, every objection I ever heard was felt as a rejection and went into the banks, the memory banks of, oh my God, I'm going to be rejected again so I'm going to take actions to avoid rejection. And the objection would be, no, I don't have time. To hear that in somebody's voice is actually not to hear, I don't have time but I don't like you, I won't even give you 27 seconds. And that'll happen. There are people who can say no, there are people who'd slam the phone down, there's people who will bark at you. All these things will happen and they accumulate so the emotional courage that it takes to be a cold caller is substantial, even with only two sentences. Even two sentences you can learn, and if you get the emotions right in your voice, you're good.  Now that the cure for it actually is not to go get [inaudible 00:03:55]. The cure is to have a belief. And the belief is in the potential goodness of what you have on offer for the other person, which is never your product. So this is the other huge problem with this approach is there's a desire to skip the step of selling the meeting, which as an object of independent value for this individual, regardless of what is ever going to happen and to jump to selling the product to the company. And that error is the standard error. Once you get past the courage question, then the question is, what do you really sound like? Are you sincere, or you're not sincere? So you need to sincerely believe something to make all of this even- Corey Frank  (04:42): So a one call close, even if it can be done, shouldn't be done because you rob the prospect of an opportunity to have this trust journey with you. You're really manipulating at that point. So even as a fuller brush sales person, even though they probably hit you over the head, there should be a one call, one door close, you would set the meeting. And that aspect of the meeting is the prize for that instance. That is the objective, that should be the only objective on a cold call at this point. Chris Beall (05:25): Yes. And therefore you must believe in your product, your product is the meeting. So you must know what they're likely to get from the meeting independent of ever moving forward to business. So the core belief for successful cold calling is to believe in the potential value of the meeting for the human being that you're talking within the downside case where there's never going to be any business done between your company and theirs. It's precisely that formulation. That's what you must believe in. And you must rationally believe in it, that is you must be able to internally defend that belief to yourself. You must know what they're going to get. And the only thing you could get from a meeting, when people have often said to me, "Oh, what does that mean, you should give them a prize like, they get a $5 gift card?"  No, you must know what they're likely to learn that will make a difference in their life no matter what. They're not sure to learn it because learning is always an iffy proposition, but there's a likelihood, a probability that they're going to walk away from that meeting knowing something they didn't know before, that's a value to them, not to their company. It may be a value to their company, but that's irrelevant. It's a value to that human being. So I'll repeat the formulation. This is the key to the whole thing. If you can accomplish this, the techniques mean almost nothing, but this is hard to accomplish. If you flip it around and you get good at the techniques, you'll get some success, but your success will be limited by the fact that you don't have the correct core belief because people are being [inaudible 00:06:57] listening to voices and they'll hear the lack of sincerity in your voice.  So what can you be sincere about? You can be sincere about this one thing and then it's so important to get there. If there were one thing I would change about every sales organization in the world would be this, that everybody who has first conversations, the leads and the potential value of the meeting that they have on offer for the human being that they're talking with, in the case where there's never going to be business done between the two companies. And those are all important, the word never is important there. Corey Frank (07:32): So belief. Chris Beall (07:33): Belief in this very specific. Belief in your product gets in the way of belief in the potential value of the meeting. If you try to combine the two beliefs [inaudible 00:07:49] . Corey Frank (07:49): But that is the fundamental dispute, they're one and the same. And they are two distinct destinations in your perspective. Chris Beall (07:58): Yes. If all you learned from me as a fuller brush man, is that there's such a thing as a spider spray that kills black widow spiders, and you don't buy any from me, you know something new, which is when you're looking for something to kill spiders with, don't use Raid, it just makes them angry, that's a value. Corey Frank (08:21): That's awesome. You're already preempting my objection. How will that benefit there? [inaudible 00:08:33] Chris Beall (08:35): That's the key. And what's so interesting is we've done the experiments. So for one of our customers who will remain on named here, we took on the project of doing a massive amount of calling for them, using our outbound on-demand service. And we got the script right, we got the messaging right. We knew that this stuff should work. And it only worked at about a 4% conversation to meeting conversion rate. And after three days, I just said, no, no, no. You know, because one of the beauties of ConnectAndSell is in three days you're done, In fact one day, you're done. You're always done in one day. Your signal has come back. If it's working, it's working. If it's not working, you should stop and fix something. That's the whole idea. So in three days, because I was paying attention to other things, I'm looking at the numbers and I go, this is insane.  We can't do what we said we would do with these conversion rates. We're below threshold and we're not moving. And oh, don't worry, they'll learn to do it better. That's never the case. They don't learn to do a better, you teach them to do it and they do it and that's it. So I listened to a bunch of recordings and I thought, what is missing here? What is missing in this paint by numbers thing that I'm hearing and what was missing was the sincerity in the tone of voice. And by the way, these callers were selected specifically for their sincerity, they're graduates of some of the finest religious colleges in the world. They're pre-filtered for sincerity. This is like packaged sincerity on steroids, and yet they were failing. And so the question is well, what's missing. And I thought, oh, well, what's missing is they don't believe in what they're selling.  And in fact, their sincerity about their religious calling is that, that's real, their sincerity about this product is zero. So what could they be sincere about? Well, they think they're selling the product, they're selling the meeting. So we got a customer to actually just tell them in a video testimonial, what the meeting did for them, not what the product did for them, and then what the product did for them. And what they learned in the meeting was that by changing how they dealt with this particular problem in their organization, which happens to be expense management, they would free up time to pursue their own strategic objectives, which is the reason they joined their company in the first place.  They learned about the opportunity to be free to do their job well, like learning that Raid makes black widow spiders angry, and that there's a spider spray that kills them. And then frees you up from having to worry about angry black widow spiders in your garage. They learned that there was a path to freedom in which, if they were to go down that path, they would find themselves with time, with the energy, with the bandwidth to do the job as they really wanted to do it. Instead of being consumed with this meaningless to them sort of ticky tack paperwork back and forth rework job that they were doing. Corey Frank (11:36): Sure. But isn't that the different evolutions of sales professionals? Like I remember an article, I think it was about 20, 25 years ago when I first got into sales by the Beverage Institute that talked about the four evolutions of sales professionals and evolution number one, well, what was called the commercial visitor. And the commercial visitor was someone who had a certain level of criteria that classified themselves as such number one, was they fell into sales by accident. Number two, they felt that sales as a profession is living on the fringe of society. This was well even before Sandler's kind of role versus identity where or supplication, they had really an essence, a high need for approval. And they felt that anytime I have to ask for something and taking something from someone and I couldn't square that circle.  And so what you're talking about these folks who had a tough time believing in the product they had to sell, and is that a fundamental mistake for a lot of sales leaders or a lot of visionary CEOs is not necessarily talking about the personal benefits of the product or the learnings that their product has, even if someone never buys, as you had said, and that instead they're dwelling on the better, faster, cheaper, rainbows unicorns world after that the prospect has purchased the product and is paying you their monthly SAS business. And it seems like there's a disconnect and identity perspective or from a messaging perspective of training these new salespeople Chris Beall (13:20): There is. And my claim is this, there is a universal product that every company has that it needs to understand and sell correctly. And that product is the discovery meeting. And it's a product that can be crafted, it can be understood like any other product, it can be described sincerely, it has to be delivered correctly. It's a real product so it has delivery. And its purpose is to help somebody understand something of value to them or potential value to them that they didn't understand before. Because the asymmetry in businesses is, if I'm the purveyor, if I'm the vendor, I know I always know more than the person I'm selling to. So the first product I can put on the shelf is the product where I share that knowledge in a way that is useful for this person, even if they don't [inaudible 00:14:11].  That's the universal product, and once you understand that that's the universal product, then you can manufacture and sell discovery meetings in a completely reliable way. And we know from the math of business, that the flow rate of discovery meetings constraints the growth of the business. It's as simple as that actually. This entire thesis is around one thing mathematically, and we were dealing with the human side like how do you get there? Right? Just the manufacturing process for these discovery meetings. But the discovery meeting itself is the product. And this is the hardest thing for sales leaders and marketing leaders together. And this is where the sales and marketing alignment question if we can explore in depth in another one of these discussions. Sales and marketing alignment happens when sales and marketing agree as to what the discovery meeting itself is as a product. As soon as that happens, the entire sales and marketing misalignment problem goes away.  Failing to do that you're left with this evil Knievel approach where I'm going to leap across this huge trust barrier and land on the buy something from a side of the Snake River Canyon. And I end up down in the bottom of the Canyon, almost every single time, which is this whole quota attainment problem and all that kind of stuff. And it's the business failure rate from businesses fail primarily because they don't establish product market fit between the product that they need to sell first and the market and the product they need to sell first is not the product they set out to build, but it's the discovery meeting. Corey Frank (15:50): And the discovery meeting, if you had to is it's an educational journey that establishes value if the person never moved forward with the product itself. Chris Beall (16:06): That's the absolute. Everything you offer along the journey to possible sale has to have independent value that is value independent of the sale itself. If I apply on that simple construct, you can generate a strategy, a series of steps that you can consistently execute between the starting point, which is being the scary invisible stranger, who is also inconvenient and a possible ending point that is not predetermined, which is somebody deciding that they want to enter into partnership with you and take advantage of your knowledge and what you have to offer as a product and the steps in between are steps of increasing trust and knowledge moving together. And so what you have to share is knowledge. So your product is knowledge and knowledge is shared in a discovery meeting and the opportunity for the person to confess, which is the breaking of a taboo to go back to the original topic, to confess their problem to you. They're paying their situation. That opportunity is actually what's on offer in the discovery meeting. The opportunity for them to confess their problem to somebody that they trust. That's actually what the product is. Corey Frank (17:22): I love it.

There is a universal product that every company has that it needs to better understand and sell more effectively and correctly. And it's a product that can be crafted and messaged just like any other product your team sells. Because it’s a real product, it requires belief in its potential value and worth from the folks that sell it. It’s a product that shouldn’t be short-cut or mis-messaged…or even try to do too much. It needs to be measured for effectiveness. And the ability to get this product in front of your list is also one of the keys to market dominance. That product is the Discovery Meeting or Discovery Call. In the episode, I ask Chris to separate fact from fiction and put some sound data and reasoning behind this misunderstood and much-maligned tool. This episode of Market Dominance Guys is The Right Tool for the Right Job, or as I like to call it, Don’t Make the Spiders Angry. ----more---- ConnectAndSell. ConnectAndSell allows your sales reps to talk to more decision-makers in 90 minutes than they would in a week or more of conventional dialing. Your reps can finally be 100% focused on selling since all of their CRM data entry and follow-up scheduling is fully automated within ConnectAndSell’s powerful platform. Your team’s effectiveness will skyrocket by using ConnectAndSell’s teleprompter capability as they’ll know exactly what to say during critical conversations. Visit, <a href="https://ConnectAndSell.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell.com</a> Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with <a href="https://uncommonpro.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">uncommonpro.com</a>. The complete transcript of this episode is below: Chris Beall (02:11): It's subtle as can be, and when people want to change it, it's really fun to listen to them because they want to change it to eliminate the taboos. They want to run from the taboos into the conventional, where they can ask some normal questions. Did I catch you at a bad time? All those kinds of questions feel... Corey Frank (02:32): Why is that, Chris? They don't want to express vulnerability, they have an inner governor that says, I don't feel confident enough, vulnerable enough, to go there. And so, it's really on them, not necessarily, they're not ready emotionally to commit themselves to that level of vulnerability in our profession. Chris Beall (02:58): Yes. And [inaudible 00:03:01] puts it perfectly, which is, every objection I ever heard was felt as a rejection and went into the banks, the memory banks of, oh my God, I'm going to be rejected again so I'm going to take actions to avoid rejection. And the objection would be, no, I don't have time. To hear that in somebody's voice is actually not to hear, I don't have time but I don't like you, I won't even give you 27 seconds. And that'll happen. There are people who can say no, there are people who'd slam the phone down, there's people who will bark at you. All these things will happen and they accumulate so the emotional courage that it takes to be a cold caller is substantial, even with only two sentences. Even two sentences you can learn, and if you get the emotions right in your voice, you're good. Now that the cure for it actually is not to go get [inaudible 00:03:55]. The cure is to have a belief. And the belief is in the potential goodness of what you have on offer for the other person, which is never your product. So this is the other huge problem with this approach is there's a desire to skip the step of selling the meeting, which as an object of independent value for this individual, regardless of what is ever going to happen and to jump to selling the product to the company. And that error is the standard error. Once you get past the courage question, then the question is, what do you really sound like? Are you sincere, or you're not sincere? So you need to sincerely believe something to make all of this even- Corey Frank  (04:42): So a one call close, even if it can be done, shouldn't be done because you rob the prospect of an opportunity to have this trust journey with you. You're really manipulating at that point. So even as a fuller brush sales person, even though they probably hit you over the head, there should be a one call, one door close, you would set the meeting. And that aspect of the meeting is the prize for that instance. That is the objective, that should be the only objective on a cold call at this point. Chris Beall (05:25): Yes. And therefore you must believe in your product, your product is the meeting. So you must know what they're likely to get from the meeting independent of ever moving forward to business. So the core belief for successful cold calling is to believe in the potential value of the meeting for the human being that you're talking within the downside case where there's never going to be any business done between your company and theirs. It's precisely that formulation. That's what you must believe in. And you must rationally believe in it, that is you must be able to internally defend that belief to yourself. You must know what they're going to get. And the only thing you could get from a meeting, when people have often said to me, "Oh, what does that mean, you should give them a prize like, they get a $5 gift card?" No, you must know what they're likely to learn that will make a difference in their life no matter what. They're not sure to learn it because learning is always an iffy proposition, but there's a likelihood, a probability that they're going to walk away from that meeting knowing something they didn't know before, that's a value to them, not to their company. It may be a value to their company, but that's irrelevant. It's a value to that human being. So I'll repeat the formulation. This is the key to the whole thing. If you can accomplish this, the techniques mean almost nothing, but this is hard to accomplish. If you flip it around and you get good at the techniques, you'll get some success, but your success will be limited by the fact that you don't have the correct core belief because people are being [inaudible 00:06:57] listening to voices and they'll hear the lack of sincerity in your voice. So what can you be sincere about? You can be sincere about this one thing and then it's so important to get there. If there were one thing I would change about every sales organization in the world would be this, that everybody who has first conversations, the leads and the potential value of the meeting that they have on offer for the human being that they're talking with, in the case where there's never going to be business done between the two companies. And those are all important, the word never is important there. Corey Frank (07:32): So belief. Chris Beall (07:33): Belief in this very specific. Belief in your product gets in the way of belief in the potential value of the meeting. If you try to combine the two beliefs [inaudible 00:07:49] . Corey Frank (07:49): But that is the fundamental dispute, they're one and the same. And they are two distinct destinations in your perspective. Chris Beall (07:58): Yes. If all you learned from me as a fuller brush man, is that there's such a thing as a spider spray that kills black widow spiders, and you don't buy any from me, you know something new, which is when you're looking for something to kill spiders with, don't use Raid, it just makes them angry, that's a value. Corey Frank (08:21): That's awesome. You're already preempting my objection. How will that benefit there? [inaudible 00:08:33] Chris Beall (08:35): That's the key. And what's so interesting is we've done the experiments. So for one of our customers who will remain on named here, we took on the project of doing a massive amount of calling for them, using our outbound on-demand service. And we got the script right, we got the messaging right. We knew that this stuff should work. And it only worked at about a 4% conversation to meeting conversion rate. And after three days, I just said, no, no, no. You know, because one of the beauties of ConnectAndSell is in three days you're done, In fact one day, you're done. You're always done in one day. Your signal has come back. If it's working, it's working. If it's not working, you should stop and fix something. That's the whole idea. So in three days, because I was paying attention to other things, I'm looking at the numbers and I go, this is insane. We can't do what we said we would do with these conversion rates. We're below threshold and we're not moving. And oh, don't worry, they'll learn to do it better. That's never the case. They don't learn to do a better, you teach them to do it and they do it and that's it. So I listened to a bunch of recordings and I thought, what is missing here? What is missing in this paint by numbers thing that I'm hearing and what was missing was the sincerity in the tone of voice. And by the way, these callers were selected specifically for their sincerity, they're graduates of some of the finest religious colleges in the world. They're pre-filtered for sincerity. This is like packaged sincerity on steroids, and yet they were failing. And so the question is well, what's missing. And I thought, oh, well, what's missing is they don't believe in what they're selling. And in fact, their sincerity about their religious calling is that, that's real, their sincerity about this product is zero. So what could they be sincere about? Well, they think they're selling the product, they're selling the meeting. So we got a customer to actually just tell them in a video testimonial, what the meeting did for them, not what the product did for them, and then what the product did for them. And what they learned in the meeting was that by changing how they dealt with this particular problem in their organization, which happens to be expense management, they would free up time to pursue their own strategic objectives, which is the reason they joined their company in the first place. They learned about the opportunity to be free to do their job well, like learning that Raid makes black widow spiders angry, and that there's a spider spray that kills them. And then frees you up from having to worry about angry black widow spiders in your garage. They learned that there was a path to freedom in which, if they were to go down that path, they would find themselves with time, with the energy, with the bandwidth to do the job as they really wanted to do it. Instead of being consumed with this meaningless to them sort of ticky tack paperwork back and forth rework job that they were doing. Corey Frank (11:36): Sure. But isn't that the different evolutions of sales professionals? Like I remember an article, I think it was about 20, 25 years ago when I first got into sales by the Beverage Institute that talked about the four evolutions of sales professionals and evolution number one, well, what was called the commercial visitor. And the commercial visitor was someone who had a certain level of criteria that classified themselves as such number one, was they fell into sales by accident. Number two, they felt that sales as a profession is living on the fringe of society. This was well even before Sandler's kind of role versus identity where or supplication, they had really an essence, a high need for approval. And they felt that anytime I have to ask for something and taking something from someone and I couldn't square that circle. And so what you're talking about these folks who had a tough time believing in the product they had to sell, and is that a fundamental mistake for a lot of sales leaders or a lot of visionary CEOs is not necessarily talking about the personal benefits of the product or the learnings that their product has, even if someone never buys, as you had said, and that instead they're dwelling on the better, faster, cheaper, rainbows unicorns world after that the prospect has purchased the product and is paying you their monthly SAS business. And it seems like there's a disconnect and identity perspective or from a messaging perspective of training these new salespeople Chris Beall (13:20): There is. And my claim is this, there is a universal product that every company has that it needs to understand and sell correctly. And that product is the discovery meeting. And it's a product that can be crafted, it can be understood like any other product, it can be described sincerely, it has to be delivered correctly. It's a real product so it has delivery. And its purpose is to help somebody understand something of value to them or potential value to them that they didn't understand before. Because the asymmetry in businesses is, if I'm the purveyor, if I'm the vendor, I know I always know more than the person I'm selling to. So the first product I can put on the shelf is the product where I share that knowledge in a way that is useful for this person, even if they don't [inaudible 00:14:11]. That's the universal product, and once you understand that that's the universal product, then you can manufacture and sell discovery meetings in a completely reliable way. And we know from the math of business, that the flow rate of discovery meetings constraints the growth of the business. It's as simple as that actually. This entire thesis is around one thing mathematically, and we were dealing with the human side like how do you get there? Right? Just the manufacturing process for these discovery meetings. But the discovery meeting itself is the product. And this is the hardest thing for sales leaders and marketing leaders together. And this is where the sales and marketing alignment question if we can explore in depth in another one of these discussions. Sales and marketing alignment happens when sales and marketing agree as to what the discovery meeting itself is as a product. As soon as that happens, the entire sales and marketing misalignment problem goes away. Failing to do that you're left with this evil Knievel approach where I'm going to leap across this huge trust barrier and land on the buy something from a side of the Snake River Canyon. And I end up down in the bottom of the Canyon, almost every single time, which is this whole quota attainment problem and all that kind of stuff. And it's the business failure rate from businesses fail primarily because they don't establish product market fit between the product that they need to sell first and the market and the product they need to sell first is not the product they set out to build, but it's the discovery meeting. Corey Frank (15:50): And the discovery meeting, if you had to is it's an educational journey that establishes value if the person never moved forward with the product itself. Chris Beall (16:06): That's the absolute. Everything you offer along the journey to possible sale has to have independent value that is value independent of the sale itself. If I apply on that simple construct, you can generate a strategy, a series of steps that you can consistently execute between the starting point, which is being the scary invisible stranger, who is also inconvenient and a possible ending point that is not predetermined, which is somebody deciding that they want to enter into partnership with you and take advantage of your knowledge and what you have to offer as a product and the steps in between are steps of increasing trust and knowledge moving together. And so what you have to share is knowledge. So your product is knowledge and knowledge is shared in a discovery meeting and the opportunity for the person to confess, which is the breaking of a taboo to go back to the original topic, to confess their problem to you. They're paying their situation. That opportunity is actually what's on offer in the discovery meeting. The opportunity for them to confess their problem to somebody that they trust. That's actually what the product is. Corey Frank (17:22): I love it.

EP7: Don‘t Make the Spiders Angry

EP13: Mr. Miyagi and the Theory of Market Dominance.

EP14: Parker Brothers Gave Me My MBA

EP19: The Best Surfer (or Sales Rep) Out There Is The One Having The Most Fun.

EP15: All Dead Companies are Equally Uninteresting.

States, lots of ‘em, 50 states. Plus Red States, Blue States. States of consciousness. Physical states. Liquid/Gas… How about the state of Markets, being Market Dominant, or simply being an “also-ran?” The fact is there are only two states you can reside in as a company: you're either dominating one market or more, or you're dominating zero. And if you're dominating zero markets, you WILL go out of business in time unless you turn into a company that IS dominating at least one market. Market Dominance is security, it’s collateral, safety, shelter, asylum, parlay; but most importantly, it’s freedom. Because the only two reasons a company dominating a market can ever go out of business is either financial mismanagement or if the market is just too small. So how do you map your journey to market dominance? What’s changed over the past few years that makes it easier for some and more difficult for others to even get out of the gates? In this chat, I ask Chris for his insights into the real stakes of entering this Octagon of business without true dominating intent. This is the Market Dominance Guys and today’s episode entitled, “The Two-State Solution in Market Dominance: Dollars or Donuts?” ----more---- ---------------------------------------- ConnectAndSell. ConnectAndSell allows your sales reps to talk to more decision-makers in 90 minutes than they would in a week or more of conventional dialing. Your reps can finally be 100% focused on selling since all of their CRM data entry and follow-up scheduling is fully automated within ConnectAndSell’s powerful platform. Your team’s effectiveness will skyrocket by using ConnectAndSell’s teleprompter capability as they’ll know exactly what to say during critical conversations. Visit, ConnectAndSell.com Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with uncommonpro.com.   The complete transcript of this episode is below:Chris Beall (02:39): It's the talk that I gave, starts with corporate strategy and the challenges of corporate strategy, and it goes all the way down to the psychological nuances of the script. In one case in the dinner case, I'll call it, I leave the details a little fuzzy. So I get to sort of the fact that there are these psychological imperatives and the language is important, but it's not a workshop. The idea is to get people discussing this controversial question which is, is it possible that an old path to dominance has gotten more difficult because of some secular changes in the world?  Which is primarily the concentration of wealth in the hands of a smaller number of people which has driven the growth of private equity, and private equity has driven the competition of money with corporates where corporates have to compete against money that has an easier job. What does the money have to do? All the money has to do is make an investment. They have to find an asset they want to invest in, and they see them as assets, not as companies. And then they put the money into that company through this complex looking process. But it's the same for all parties who might ever want to buy that company, no different.  They have more flexibility. They can take positions from whole ownership down to some fraction, which a corporate can't do, corporate needs control. So they have a wider variety of targets they can go after. They have no requirement to integrate, none whatsoever. You can buy the company and just let it run, or they can buy it and put in new management, or they can buy it and have a thesis about operations, or they can buy it and combine it with another company.  They can do anything that they want, right? I'm a corporate when I buy a company, what can I do? I can either let it run independently and decide whether the law says I have to consolidate the books or not. And then I can say, "Well, I've added it to my portfolio, and I'm going to seek synergies later at the SSL approach, or I'm going to integrate that company into mine, into the acquiring company, which is known to fail 90% of the time.  So as a corporation, I have to pay up. Now I have to pay premium prices for an asset that may or may not be the right asset because I can only learn so much about it before acquiring it. And after acquiring, and I have to do more work with a higher failure rate. The guy I'm competing with just does his due diligence strokes a check and says, "Yeah, we'll flip it later."  Right? So that path to strategy, that mountain that sits in front of me has gotten steeper and steeper and bigger and bigger and corporate strategy, which is, essentially, which markets am I going to go at? Right. I have product strategy too, but even there, I tend to execute as a big corporate, I execute through acquisition. And product strategy, I still can kind of do it that way. The venture capitalists take care of that problem for me.  They build the research and development labs off there in Silicon Valley and Silicon slopes and Austin and Boston and all those places. And all of these people come to work for them thinking that they're starting these businesses, but all they're really doing is just working for these laboratories that are working on categories of problems. [inaudible 00:05:42] isn't quite happy because they get a free labor and they have a salvage operation running, just strip the IP out of these things if the business didn't work, which they don't really care about, the business that is.  That business's a demo of value for a future acquire and every once in a while, you'd do kind of demonstration make one of them. So as that game is played, no problem. Product strategy is a big corporate. I could choose to make my own products and take them to market, but that fails almost every time. Now, some people know how to do that. Half of those people are talking to you right now. So it's so uncommon that it's just not even worth considering a product strategy.  But your big strategy is market strategy. I need to go and take a new market because market domination is by strong evidence, the only insurance against business failure. So that's actually where I start this talk, which is quite surprising to people. I say to them, the fact is there are only two states you can be in as a company. You're either dominating one market or more, or you're dominating zero.  If you're dominating zero, you will go out of business, unless you turn into a company that's dominating at least one market. The only reason a company dominating a market can ever go out of business, or two. One is financial mismanagement to the point where you can't even recover in a market dominance position. Usually you take on too much overhead. So if your overhead is so big and you can't figure out how to get rid of it, or you're too dumb to get rid of it. And if your market is too small, then dominating a market, doesn't ensure your survival. Corey Frank (07:24): So, what is defined as a market, Chris. Chris Beall (07:25): I use Jeffrey Morris' definition. So a market is a list or set actually, but a set is usually expressed as a list, of mutually referenceable companies. That is, they have the mathematical property that when one of them buys a product from vendor A, a specific product X from vendor A, then every other participant in that market, everybody else in that set becomes more likely to buy that product at the same price or under the same conditions of knowledge.  So you keep lowering the cost, the internal cost, your cost as a seller of taking the next unit within the market of advancing in the market as you take units. So markets essentially are mathematically downhill operations. Once you get a Boulder rolling downhill, it rolls faster and faster and picks up more boulders, right? So in a market, once you get that first customer, which is very hard to get, by definition, anybody else who's positively influenced to buy from you, that particular product by definition, they're in that market.  If I will buy, because you bought a little bit mean. I'm a little more likely to buy because you bought, you and I are in the same market for that particular product. And that's it. It's just a mathematical concept. It's a set of all of those who are mutually, mutually reinforcing with regard to their desire to buy. And the reason for markets being defined like this, and this is markets for, usually not entirely estate, which categories, but if I'm a company coming into a space I'm not established. So I've got the same problem as though I have a new product or innovation.  I'm new. New is bad. Nobody wants to buy new in business, right? Everybody wants to buy new as a consumer because as a consumer, I'm putting my money at risk. And if I'm identity as a consumer is wrapped up around, like my social status is wrapped up around the perception of other people that I do, new things, then I'm easy to sell to.  This is what consumer products tend to come into the market quickly. If they hit a little subset that are like, wow, that's the cool thing. And then cool tends to take them either up a big or they just eat the cool factor. And that's all they get is the cool ones, right? There was no equivalent of that in business, except a tiny fraction of people called technology enthusiasts that you can sell to and you can sell new stuff to them. And they were very, very small and they flame out quickly.  In the business world, people are afraid for their jobs when I buy, I fear for my job. So I'm not sure surely much more conservative than when I'm risking my money because I'm not risking my money anymore. I'm not risking the price, right? If even if I buy a Tesla, the worst cases, I melt the price of a Tesla minus the resale value of a Tesla, right?  So I take it off the lot and then I sell it the next day because I hate it, because it turns out those two big screens make me have seizures while I'm driving or something. And it's like, "Well, I got to get rid of this Tesla." What if I might lose, I don't know, 5,000 bucks. It's not so bad. If I buy my company a Tesla, so to speak, and we could commit to a business process in which the Tesla is essential to the business process.  This is how we're going to get to our conferences from now on. We're not going to fly. We're going to drive this Tesla really fast. And then we discover, Oh, darn their speed limits. We hadn't taken into account that there are speed limits. It will go really fast, but we can't go that fast. And now it's too expensive to get to all the conferences we need to go to, and we're going to go out of business. "Hey Chris, why'd you buy the Tesla? Why didn't you stick with the airplanes?" "While they're kind of expensive and all that and the Tesla promise to be cheaper and blah, blah, blah."  It's like, Oh, okay. So you failed to notice something in your analysis and we're not letting you ever buy anything again. So we're going to take your power away. Maybe take your job away. So what am I risking? Oh let's see my reputation by kids' college education, my retirement, my respect in the community, whether my wife stays with me, husband, dog, whatever. I risk everything [inaudible 00:11:39] it could be to be first bigger or the newer, the scarier.  So what's so unique about B2B and what frankly drives me crazy when I see these predictions that B2B will go to the way it BBC, and it'll all just be easy buying online. It has to do with how much information the buyer has. It has nothing to do with how much information the buyer has. In fact, the 180 degree opposite. The more information the buyer has accessible to them in B2B, the less inclined they are to buy. Because the information is all vendor information or vendor influenced information. You can't tell. It's the fake news problem. It's all fake  To some degree, every single thing anybody says about any commercially available B2B product is shaded in the direction of trying to influence the buyer to make a decision. The buyer knows that, and the buyer knows that decision could cost them their career Corey Frank (12:34): The B2B buyer knows that. [crosstalk 00:12:36]. Chris Beall (12:38): That's right but the B2B buyer has this, their consumer, when they get up in the morning. They drive to work in their car and they close their car door. They walk with their briefcase up to security, and as soon as they scan their badge and they go into their cubicle, it's almost as if the air is piped in differently or the ceiling tiles or the magnetic forces change them to these risk averse pieces of mankind, versus they'd be so risky to buy something on their own money, but they come into this environment and they have much more of a sensitivity to marketing information, product information, the phone ringing in a sales or a stranger on the other end of the line. So it's the same person on the weekend between Monday to Friday, but the stakes are higher. Is that what I hear you saying? Corey Frank (13:34): Exactly. The stakes are so high. They're so high that only somebody who is so reckless that nobody would ever let them buy anything for a company just goes out and goes, Oh, I'll just get one of these. They'll just get whatever it is. Even something as simple as a conference. Look at the decision to buy something as simple as, "I think we'll go to this conference," not even as a sponsor. Very simple. Risk isn't that high? You don't like the conference. You don't go again.  And yet a committee will form around it. People's opinions will be asked, right? It's not this idea that... In fact here's the contradiction. Okay. The big contradiction. So we're told us sellers, two things are going on. One is our B2B buyers are becoming consumer-like, and the other is the buying committee is getting bigger. Now think about that physically.  A consumer privately sits there in front of their computer or on their smartphone, and it looks at some information and gets influenced by influencers, whoever it is, Kim Kardashian or whatever. And they go as a consumer, "Oh, I think I want this, click, click, click. And they have like buy with one click on Amazon and all that kind of stuff, right?  The B2B buyer, we're told, does the same thing more and more each day. And yet somehow they're doing it by committee. The committee is getting bigger. So what is the committee all sit around at that person's desktop and stare at the stuff and go, "No click here. No click there." It's physically impossible to reconcile the notion of the B2B buyer becoming more like the B2C buyer and the committee growing, ever larger and more influential.  They're opposite ideas and yet we're fed both of them by the pundits. The experts in B2B sales, with the exception of what I'll call the four horsemen of Outbound, right? Jeb Blount, Anthony Iannarino, Mike Weinberg, Mark Hunter, people around that set go, "No, no, no, you don't get it. None of that stuff's happened." What's happening is the scared buyer is still the scared buyer I must talk to a seller that they learned to trust. And that seller is when it tell them what to buy. And they're going to earn that trust by being trust able at the beginning, and then trust worthy over time.  They actually have information asymmetry. They know better than the buyer, and so they will be the trusted advisor. Think of the contradiction between the B2B buyer being B2C and the need for the trusted advisor and the growth of the committee. All of these are contradictory ideas. And nobody exposes the contradiction. "Oh no, no. They're all happening." Why? Because as an expert, I can make more money selling sales techniques to you. If you believe all this crap, right?  But what's really happening is nothing has changed, except this internet thing has provided so much additional information in the form of scary noise. The buyer has become more conservative rather than less. And that more conservative buyer expresses themselves in the larger committee. The committee is an insurance policy against the individual buyer, making the decision and being held accountable. So the committee is not a corporate idea like, "Wow, we need to have 10 people involved in every sale."  It is, "Wow! It's so confusing out there. Things are moving so fast. So if velocity increasing and information flow and availability increasing. And so here I am as the buyer, what do I do for safety? There's safety in numbers. I'm not going to make this decision by myself. I'm going to make it with others. However, only one person in that committee, whoever it is who kind of is guiding it, or is the person that everybody else is looking to the person who would have been alone. If there hadn't been the committee, that person is going to rely completely on trusting one of the sellers more than they trust themselves.  The threshold for a B2B purchase decision is not to trust one of the sellers more than you trust the other sellers. It's to trust one of the sellers more than you trust yourself. This is the essence of the B2B equations from a market dominance standpoint. Now we go all the way back to, Oh, look what happened. Private equity came in and wrecked the landscape for buying companies in order to enter markets.  So now I have to enter markets by myself, which means I have to sell my way into markets. So now I'm on the outside, my buyers are these cautious creatures who aggregated into these committees when they're doing serious buying. So I have to somehow gain an advantage there over all my competitors in order to dominate this market.  Before I could take my balance sheet and get an advantage by cleverly identifying a company that was ready to sell itself. To me, that's hard. Now I have to do something though 100 times harder, which is I've got to get this cautious animal called the B2B buyer first identified, as to find them. Then I got to get their trust. And then I got to grow their trust through a process in which new players are going to come in and that trust has got to go out into the committee, somehow.  I have to exceed a threshold I'm not aware of, which is they have to trust me more than they trust themselves. Otherwise, they're going to go to the standard outcome of a B2B buyer, which is no decision. 90% of all B2B purchasing processes end in no decision. The reason is none of the sellers climb the mountain high enough, the trust mountain high enough to be trusted more than the buyer trust themselves. This is the essence of the entire market domination and therefore survival question for every B2B company.

States, lots of ‘em, 50 states. Plus Red States, Blue States. States of consciousness. Physical states. Liquid/Gas… How about the state of Markets, being Market Dominant, or simply being an “also-ran?” The fact is there are only two states you can reside in as a company: you're either dominating one market or more, or you're dominating zero. And if you're dominating zero markets, you WILL go out of business in time unless you turn into a company that IS dominating at least one market. Market Dominance is security, it’s collateral, safety, shelter, asylum, parlay; but most importantly, it’s freedom. Because the only two reasons a company dominating a market can ever go out of business is either financial mismanagement or if the market is just too small. So how do you map your journey to market dominance? What’s changed over the past few years that makes it easier for some and more difficult for others to even get out of the gates? In this chat, I ask Chris for his insights into the real stakes of entering this Octagon of business without true dominating intent. This is the Market Dominance Guys and today’s episode entitled, “The Two-State Solution in Market Dominance: Dollars or Donuts?” ----more---- ---------------------------------------- ConnectAndSell. ConnectAndSell allows your sales reps to talk to more decision-makers in 90 minutes than they would in a week or more of conventional dialing. Your reps can finally be 100% focused on selling since all of their CRM data entry and follow-up scheduling is fully automated within ConnectAndSell’s powerful platform. Your team’s effectiveness will skyrocket by using ConnectAndSell’s teleprompter capability as they’ll know exactly what to say during critical conversations. Visit, <a href="https://ConnectAndSell.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell.com</a> Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with <a href="https://uncommonpro.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">uncommonpro.com</a>.  The complete transcript of this episode is below: Chris Beall (02:39): It's the talk that I gave, starts with corporate strategy and the challenges of corporate strategy, and it goes all the way down to the psychological nuances of the script. In one case in the dinner case, I'll call it, I leave the details a little fuzzy. So I get to sort of the fact that there are these psychological imperatives and the language is important, but it's not a workshop. The idea is to get people discussing this controversial question which is, is it possible that an old path to dominance has gotten more difficult because of some secular changes in the world? Which is primarily the concentration of wealth in the hands of a smaller number of people which has driven the growth of private equity, and private equity has driven the competition of money with corporates where corporates have to compete against money that has an easier job. What does the money have to do? All the money has to do is make an investment. They have to find an asset they want to invest in, and they see them as assets, not as companies. And then they put the money into that company through this complex looking process. But it's the same for all parties who might ever want to buy that company, no different. They have more flexibility. They can take positions from whole ownership down to some fraction, which a corporate can't do, corporate needs control. So they have a wider variety of targets they can go after. They have no requirement to integrate, none whatsoever. You can buy the company and just let it run, or they can buy it and put in new management, or they can buy it and have a thesis about operations, or they can buy it and combine it with another company. They can do anything that they want, right? I'm a corporate when I buy a company, what can I do? I can either let it run independently and decide whether the law says I have to consolidate the books or not. And then I can say, "Well, I've added it to my portfolio, and I'm going to seek synergies later at the SSL approach, or I'm going to integrate that company into mine, into the acquiring company, which is known to fail 90% of the time. So as a corporation, I have to pay up. Now I have to pay premium prices for an asset that may or may not be the right asset because I can only learn so much about it before acquiring it. And after acquiring, and I have to do more work with a higher failure rate. The guy I'm competing with just does his due diligence strokes a check and says, "Yeah, we'll flip it later." Right? So that path to strategy, that mountain that sits in front of me has gotten steeper and steeper and bigger and bigger and corporate strategy, which is, essentially, which markets am I going to go at? Right. I have product strategy too, but even there, I tend to execute as a big corporate, I execute through acquisition. And product strategy, I still can kind of do it that way. The venture capitalists take care of that problem for me. They build the research and development labs off there in Silicon Valley and Silicon slopes and Austin and Boston and all those places. And all of these people come to work for them thinking that they're starting these businesses, but all they're really doing is just working for these laboratories that are working on categories of problems. [inaudible 00:05:42] isn't quite happy because they get a free labor and they have a salvage operation running, just strip the IP out of these things if the business didn't work, which they don't really care about, the business that is. That business's a demo of value for a future acquire and every once in a while, you'd do kind of demonstration make one of them. So as that game is played, no problem. Product strategy is a big corporate. I could choose to make my own products and take them to market, but that fails almost every time. Now, some people know how to do that. Half of those people are talking to you right now. So it's so uncommon that it's just not even worth considering a product strategy. But your big strategy is market strategy. I need to go and take a new market because market domination is by strong evidence, the only insurance against business failure. So that's actually where I start this talk, which is quite surprising to people. I say to them, the fact is there are only two states you can be in as a company. You're either dominating one market or more, or you're dominating zero. If you're dominating zero, you will go out of business, unless you turn into a company that's dominating at least one market. The only reason a company dominating a market can ever go out of business, or two. One is financial mismanagement to the point where you can't even recover in a market dominance position. Usually you take on too much overhead. So if your overhead is so big and you can't figure out how to get rid of it, or you're too dumb to get rid of it. And if your market is too small, then dominating a market, doesn't ensure your survival. Corey Frank (07:24): So, what is defined as a market, Chris. Chris Beall (07:25): I use Jeffrey Morris' definition. So a market is a list or set actually, but a set is usually expressed as a list, of mutually referenceable companies. That is, they have the mathematical property that when one of them buys a product from vendor A, a specific product X from vendor A, then every other participant in that market, everybody else in that set becomes more likely to buy that product at the same price or under the same conditions of knowledge. So you keep lowering the cost, the internal cost, your cost as a seller of taking the next unit within the market of advancing in the market as you take units. So markets essentially are mathematically downhill operations. Once you get a Boulder rolling downhill, it rolls faster and faster and picks up more boulders, right? So in a market, once you get that first customer, which is very hard to get, by definition, anybody else who's positively influenced to buy from you, that particular product by definition, they're in that market. If I will buy, because you bought a little bit mean. I'm a little more likely to buy because you bought, you and I are in the same market for that particular product. And that's it. It's just a mathematical concept. It's a set of all of those who are mutually, mutually reinforcing with regard to their desire to buy. And the reason for markets being defined like this, and this is markets for, usually not entirely estate, which categories, but if I'm a company coming into a space I'm not established. So I've got the same problem as though I have a new product or innovation. I'm new. New is bad. Nobody wants to buy new in business, right? Everybody wants to buy new as a consumer because as a consumer, I'm putting my money at risk. And if I'm identity as a consumer is wrapped up around, like my social status is wrapped up around the perception of other people that I do, new things, then I'm easy to sell to. This is what consumer products tend to come into the market quickly. If they hit a little subset that are like, wow, that's the cool thing. And then cool tends to take them either up a big or they just eat the cool factor. And that's all they get is the cool ones, right? There was no equivalent of that in business, except a tiny fraction of people called technology enthusiasts that you can sell to and you can sell new stuff to them. And they were very, very small and they flame out quickly. In the business world, people are afraid for their jobs when I buy, I fear for my job. So I'm not sure surely much more conservative than when I'm risking my money because I'm not risking my money anymore. I'm not risking the price, right? If even if I buy a Tesla, the worst cases, I melt the price of a Tesla minus the resale value of a Tesla, right? So I take it off the lot and then I sell it the next day because I hate it, because it turns out those two big screens make me have seizures while I'm driving or something. And it's like, "Well, I got to get rid of this Tesla." What if I might lose, I don't know, 5,000 bucks. It's not so bad. If I buy my company a Tesla, so to speak, and we could commit to a business process in which the Tesla is essential to the business process. This is how we're going to get to our conferences from now on. We're not going to fly. We're going to drive this Tesla really fast. And then we discover, Oh, darn their speed limits. We hadn't taken into account that there are speed limits. It will go really fast, but we can't go that fast. And now it's too expensive to get to all the conferences we need to go to, and we're going to go out of business. "Hey Chris, why'd you buy the Tesla? Why didn't you stick with the airplanes?" "While they're kind of expensive and all that and the Tesla promise to be cheaper and blah, blah, blah." It's like, Oh, okay. So you failed to notice something in your analysis and we're not letting you ever buy anything again. So we're going to take your power away. Maybe take your job away. So what am I risking? Oh let's see my reputation by kids' college education, my retirement, my respect in the community, whether my wife stays with me, husband, dog, whatever. I risk everything [inaudible 00:11:39] it could be to be first bigger or the newer, the scarier. So what's so unique about B2B and what frankly drives me crazy when I see these predictions that B2B will go to the way it BBC, and it'll all just be easy buying online. It has to do with how much information the buyer has. It has nothing to do with how much information the buyer has. In fact, the 180 degree opposite. The more information the buyer has accessible to them in B2B, the less inclined they are to buy. Because the information is all vendor information or vendor influenced information. You can't tell. It's the fake news problem. It's all fake To some degree, every single thing anybody says about any commercially available B2B product is shaded in the direction of trying to influence the buyer to make a decision. The buyer knows that, and the buyer knows that decision could cost them their career Corey Frank (12:34): The B2B buyer knows that. [crosstalk 00:12:36]. Chris Beall (12:38): That's right but the B2B buyer has this, their consumer, when they get up in the morning. They drive to work in their car and they close their car door. They walk with their briefcase up to security, and as soon as they scan their badge and they go into their cubicle, it's almost as if the air is piped in differently or the ceiling tiles or the magnetic forces change them to these risk averse pieces of mankind, versus they'd be so risky to buy something on their own money, but they come into this environment and they have much more of a sensitivity to marketing information, product information, the phone ringing in a sales or a stranger on the other end of the line. So it's the same person on the weekend between Monday to Friday, but the stakes are higher. Is that what I hear you saying? Corey Frank (13:34): Exactly. The stakes are so high. They're so high that only somebody who is so reckless that nobody would ever let them buy anything for a company just goes out and goes, Oh, I'll just get one of these. They'll just get whatever it is. Even something as simple as a conference. Look at the decision to buy something as simple as, "I think we'll go to this conference," not even as a sponsor. Very simple. Risk isn't that high? You don't like the conference. You don't go again. And yet a committee will form around it. People's opinions will be asked, right? It's not this idea that... In fact here's the contradiction. Okay. The big contradiction. So we're told us sellers, two things are going on. One is our B2B buyers are becoming consumer-like, and the other is the buying committee is getting bigger. Now think about that physically. A consumer privately sits there in front of their computer or on their smartphone, and it looks at some information and gets influenced by influencers, whoever it is, Kim Kardashian or whatever. And they go as a consumer, "Oh, I think I want this, click, click, click. And they have like buy with one click on Amazon and all that kind of stuff, right? The B2B buyer, we're told, does the same thing more and more each day. And yet somehow they're doing it by committee. The committee is getting bigger. So what is the committee all sit around at that person's desktop and stare at the stuff and go, "No click here. No click there." It's physically impossible to reconcile the notion of the B2B buyer becoming more like the B2C buyer and the committee growing, ever larger and more influential. They're opposite ideas and yet we're fed both of them by the pundits. The experts in B2B sales, with the exception of what I'll call the four horsemen of Outbound, right? Jeb Blount, Anthony Iannarino, Mike Weinberg, Mark Hunter, people around that set go, "No, no, no, you don't get it. None of that stuff's happened." What's happening is the scared buyer is still the scared buyer I must talk to a seller that they learned to trust. And that seller is when it tell them what to buy. And they're going to earn that trust by being trust able at the beginning, and then trust worthy over time. They actually have information asymmetry. They know better than the buyer, and so they will be the trusted advisor. Think of the contradiction between the B2B buyer being B2C and the need for the trusted advisor and the growth of the committee. All of these are contradictory ideas. And nobody exposes the contradiction. "Oh no, no. They're all happening." Why? Because as an expert, I can make more money selling sales techniques to you. If you believe all this crap, right? But what's really happening is nothing has changed, except this internet thing has provided so much additional information in the form of scary noise. The buyer has become more conservative rather than less. And that more conservative buyer expresses themselves in the larger committee. The committee is an insurance policy against the individual buyer, making the decision and being held accountable. So the committee is not a corporate idea like, "Wow, we need to have 10 people involved in every sale." It is, "Wow! It's so confusing out there. Things are moving so fast. So if velocity increasing and information flow and availability increasing. And so here I am as the buyer, what do I do for safety? There's safety in numbers. I'm not going to make this decision by myself. I'm going to make it with others. However, only one person in that committee, whoever it is who kind of is guiding it, or is the person that everybody else is looking to the person who would have been alone. If there hadn't been the committee, that person is going to rely completely on trusting one of the sellers more than they trust themselves. The threshold for a B2B purchase decision is not to trust one of the sellers more than you trust the other sellers. It's to trust one of the sellers more than you trust yourself. This is the essence of the B2B equations from a market dominance standpoint. Now we go all the way back to, Oh, look what happened. Private equity came in and wrecked the landscape for buying companies in order to enter markets. So now I have to enter markets by myself, which means I have to sell my way into markets. So now I'm on the outside, my buyers are these cautious creatures who aggregated into these committees when they're doing serious buying. So I have to somehow gain an advantage there over all my competitors in order to dominate this market. Before I could take my balance sheet and get an advantage by cleverly identifying a company that was ready to sell itself. To me, that's hard. Now I have to do something though 100 times harder, which is I've got to get this cautious animal called the B2B buyer first identified, as to find them. Then I got to get their trust. And then I got to grow their trust through a process in which new players are going to come in and that trust has got to go out into the committee, somehow. I have to exceed a threshold I'm not aware of, which is they have to trust me more than they trust themselves. Otherwise, they're going to go to the standard outcome of a B2B buyer, which is no decision. 90% of all B2B purchasing processes end in no decision. The reason is none of the sellers climb the mountain high enough, the trust mountain high enough to be trusted more than the buyer trust themselves. This is the essence of the entire market domination and therefore survival question for every B2B company.

EP11: The Two-State Solution in Market Dominance: Dollars or Donuts?

EP3: The Hard Truths About Taking VC Funding

Today, when you examine the toolbox of the modern sales professional, many of us immediately see the abundance of options in the marketing and sales stacks that decorate most of our desktops…I have tools that can disguise my phone number, I know when someone opens an email, I can do a virtual face to face meeting…AI and machine learning tools even tell me what to say and who I should say it to…a scale of portable technology and advancement and capital on any ordinary rep desktop that would leave an Apollo-era NASA slide-ruled engineer in your dust. But what about the techniques, behaviors, and go to market strategies of that same modern sales professional? Sadly, for most of us, we’re still stranded in mid-century America. But not the mid 20th Century,  rather, I’m speaking of the mid 19th Century America of 33 states. The mid-century of America where the new hot book on the scene was not Good To Great or The Lean Startup, but instead a fresh little nautical fiction text entitled Moby Dick. In this episode, Chris takes us through a virtual time warp of strategy, territories, and compensation as a salesperson. Some things have indeed changed, But some remain firmly entrenched in a midcentury President Franklin Pierce’s America. This is the Market Dominance Guys and today’s episode “Get the DeLorean; My Profession is Stuck in 1855!” ----more---- ---------------------------------------- ConnectAndSell. ConnectAndSell allows your sales reps to talk to more decision-makers in 90 minutes than they would in a week or more of conventional dialing. Your reps can finally be 100% focused on selling since all of their CRM data entry and follow-up scheduling is fully automated within ConnectAndSell’s powerful platform. Your team’s effectiveness will skyrocket by using ConnectAndSell’s teleprompter capability as they’ll know exactly what to say during critical conversations. Visit, ConnectAndSell.com Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with uncommonpro.com. The complete transcript of this episode is below:Corey Frank (02:42): When we were doing the test drive with you, at Stormwind we had ConnectAndSell, and we were doing pretty well and we're spending lots of money. Tom says we should probably try another competitor just in case. Well, there are no other competitors. Came back with this company called ConnectLeader. Chris Beall (02:57): Oh yeah. Corey Frank (02:57): Oh, okay. Well, sure I kind of felt that yeah, that's the right thing to do for the business. Chris Beall (03:03): Right. Corey Frank (03:03): You know, brought those guys in and you know how the movie ends, right? We probably lasted maybe, gosh, maybe a month with those guys after like three months with you. And then I come crawling back to you and the services, give or take let's just say from Tom's perspective, the services were roughly the same. The biggest difference was the trust factor that I had, because we've probably known each other maybe 10 years before Stormwind and had various interactions. So I did trust you more than I trusted myself. Right? And people like Chad or Steve in the marketplace as well, there are certain folks that I do trust, which is why you seek out their counsel, you seek out their advice. You probably don't set one foot in the AASP Conference in Chicago, you don't even get into the breakout rooms before somebody sees you at the hotel check-in and says, "Oh wait, Chris, I got a quick question about ABC vendor. You're familiar with them." Chris Beall (04:04): I can't physically get into the building, which is great. Corey Frank (04:11): Yeah, because this trust oozes from you, people do trust you. Is that a little bit of that I may have a superior product? I may have even an exceptional list, but if my salespeople are not trained with true empathy and I don't hire to that, that they'll never get to that threshold. Or I may succeed in spite of my sales team, but how conscious should I be as we're going down this path of market dominance in the selection of the people who give that message? Chris Beall (04:46): Hugely careful, this is where hiring somebody who even exaggerates a little bit is highly problematic. I know some who do and get away with it, but they exaggerate transparently. That is, it's a joke. You know, Steve's the opposite. Steve Richard is hyper precise. Steve will never tell you a number that he doesn't know is true. He just won't do it. So there are two personalities out there in the public that take different approaches to it. But when you're hiring a salesperson and you get that person who shades what they say a little bit in order to influence somebody, the problem is that it is the web of lies problem. You can't play it. At some point it just gets problematic.  But the other problem is, human beings are to sincerity as wolves are to fear. They smell it, our insincerity, right? Human beings smell insincerity, and the only people that can get away with being insincere in a sales situation are psychopaths. And there are psychopaths out there, sociopath's whatever you want to call them, who actually have perfected the art of causing people to trust them, even though their intentions are very, very bad. Those people exist. They make up a special subset of society they've existed for all time. They have some function out there. I'm sure you can send them in among your enemies. You might get something good to happen. Some of them are in certain industries that are interesting. I would imagine if I were going to be, say a true undercover spy, living in somebody else's society for 40 years, with intent to subvert them, it would probably be pretty handy to be a sociopath or psychopath because then I could get people to trust me because I manufacture it.  But for most of us, for the vast, vast majority of people, we're stuck with actually having good intentions, sincerely having good intentions in order to be trusted. And that's a funny place for a sales person to be. In fact, when we compensate salespeople, we're basically saying to them, "you know what, I don't trust you to actually put the effort in and do this correctly so I'm only going to pay you for what you bring in." Everybody else in the company we pay because they do what we asked them to do and we've designed that process. If they do a diligently and they interact with other people in the company, in a way that's helpful, or at least not too hurtful, we keep paying their salaries and unless their job description goes away, they get to stay with us, right?  Salespeople, we give them the opposite message. We say, you're an outsider. We're going to pay you as little as possible for doing the job and as much as possible for the results, we don't care how you get the results. We just don't care. Just bring in the number, right? And then we kind of hope that we get sincere people. It used to be, you didn't have to be that sincere to play the scan. So now we have a new situation. It's going to be very interesting to me to see what happens in the world of sales compensation. Sales compensation is based on the notion that sales itself is an external function of the company. Sales is not inside the company, it's outside. It's an appendage, notice where it is on the P and L S G and A sales general and administrative. What, what in the world?  We've lumped it in with the electricity that we buy, the rent that we pay. You have to have a sales function, whatever that is right? The sales job was always to convert inventory that was being generated by a factory. So it's the essence of how sales is thought of as an outgrowth of the core structure of capitalism. So capitalism says this, Hey, I got to have capital to make stuff, because you make stuff with machines, right? That's why capitalism was interesting because machines represent the ability to make more than an individual human working with their hands, with the tools they might've accumulated, say were handed from their mom, their dad, right? So if I'm a carpenter in 1600, well, I apprentice to a carpenter, probably my dad. I borrow his tools for a while and then when my dad retires or passes on or cuts his hand off or whatever the hell he does, those tools become mine. And my skills are mine and I take my trade out and I do my trade. Chris Beall (10:04): That's not capitalism. What's the upside of having capital? That would do you no good. In fact, it'd be bad. It would take away the spirit to go out and work. Corey Frank (10:14): Right. Chris Beall (10:14): Idleness, right? I've seen books, very sacred books that talk about how dangerous it is to have [crosstalk 00:10:22]. They're not the right ones, the [inaudible 00:10:25] issues. So there's only so many forms of entertainment. Corey Frank (10:30): Getting pregnant. Chris Beall (10:31): So then we come along and it's like, okay, wait a second, we figured out how to take the stuff of the earth; coal, rain falls uphill and runs downhill. Just a couple of things and turn that stuff into motion. And we figured out how to harness that motion and turn that motion into inputs turning into valuable outputs without a person doing it. And now we say, "Oh, well look at this. I can make cotton gin."  Well, what does a cotton gin do? It solves one problem and it creates another problem. The problem is I can run the thing all day long. I can run it all night long. I can do it with two people, one in the day, one in the night, because people need to sleep. That's it, two people doing the job of a hundred people. So now I have this output. I got to dispose of the output. Now I need sales to dispose of the output and turn it into cash.  Why do I want the cash? Because the cash is capital to get a new machine and double my productivity, double my production, not my productivity, but my production. So, capitalism produced this beautiful thing, which is a positive feedback loop between the gross profit produced by sales and the future size of my company. Because as long as I have access to the inputs, which is why big companies became vertically integrated, I need my own coal. I need my own iron ore, right? They have integrated supply chains and they did that because interruption of supply would cause your capital to go idle. Your machines would go idle.  Sales' job was to keep up with the output and the primary way sales did that was by dynamically adjusting price within individual markets called territories; it was always geographical, in order to make sure that all the output was disposed of. So the reason for the great discounting culture in sales is that the job of sales was to dispose of the output. You can't have inventory buildup forever. You got to sell the stuff off in order to be able to buy the raw materials that you needed to make the stuff in the first place and then in order to be able to potentially expand the business. So sales is still stuck in 1855. Still looks exactly like it did in 1855, which is, I hire you, I give you a territory and you have discounting authority. And you'll only exercise it to a particular degree because your commission depends on how much you sell. So the discipline is provided by the commission. Corey Frank (12:59): And I have extra inventory and I need to get it down to a certain level to keep these machines going and I need a machine [inaudible 00:13:06]. Chris Beall (13:06): It's very simple, right? Why sales exists and why it sits there on SGNA. Why sales doesn't sit, where it should set today, which is right in R and D. Sales is actually a form of development at this point. It's development of the thing you need more than a product, which is a market. The scarcity in the world has gone away from products. You can build products anytime you want. See this product here, this little coffee cup with all of this stuff on it, it's my wife's name and all this cool stuff. I can go on Zazzle and have one of these things made for me. I can have a hundred mate, I can have 10,000 made. And all I do is go click, click, "no I don't want it to say this, I want it to say this. No, I don't want the color to be white I want the color to be beige. No, I don't want that size, I want the handle to look different." Right?  Think what that used to take 150 years ago, a hundred years ago, 50 years, 30 years ago. That's huge to make that design decision. We made molds, we have jigs, we have this, we have that. My capital had to be affected. Products are nothing nowadays. Markets are [inaudible 00:14:11]. I was talking to a guy last night about a radical product, a product that will change the world. I can describe it at the very highest levels. It's a product that would allow any owner of any company to know what their company is worth at no cost. Just like you can know what your house is worth through Zillow, you can know what your company is [crosstalk 00:14:34] super valuable product.  Anybody can see how valuable it is, right? If you could do that and make the product, you do it. Well, you can do that and make the product. It turns out to build that product, if you have the deep knowledge of that domain, which this individual happens to have, is a matter of calling up [inaudible 00:14:50] and saying, Hey, Tesh would you take a $100,000 to build this for me in six weeks? And he goes, sure, yeah, maybe whatever. I don't know, I'm busy, whatever. Right? So say decides to do it. You're going to get a usable product within six weeks that will change the world. [crosstalk 00:15:06] a marketing problem. Corey Frank (15:08): Right. Chris Beall (15:09): Your product problem has gone down, which is why VCs will no longer fund ideas because the products are so easy to build. They're going, if you bring me an idea, what's wrong with you, why didn't you build the product? So they won't play that game anymore. But the [inaudible 00:15:26], is to go to market game as a demo for a future acquire. But if you're a serious corporate, that is, you're stuck with survival. As a corporation when you get to a certain point, the option of just throwing yourself away, is not so great. If you're a startup, fine, you throw yourself away. You get bought by somebody for whatever the going price is. Everybody's got a formula such and such X revenue, but this category of company, blah, blah, blah, right? But if you're running a hundred million dollar company that you've built up over time, you don't have one market you dominate?  Somehow say two of your markets that you used to dominate dissolved through secular forces, they're not there anymore. So you're going to go out of business. It's not an "if" it is a "when". You will go out of business essentially for a simple mathematical reason, someone else will come in and dominate one of your markets that you're playing in. And as you lose share, you'll have to discount like an old fashioned sales guy in order to maintain what feels like share in the market but it actually is going down because the gross profit contribution of each unit that you're selling in that market on a repeated basis is going down and you're hollowing out your company. Corey Frank (16:33): Okay, so if I take this in continuous equation here, superior products, better than average products may not necessarily win in the end if their go to market strategy, their sales staff is not at a superior level. In other words, all of the things being equal in a vacuum, a superior sales force with a substandard product will beat a standard product with a substandard sales force over time, over an extended period of time. Chris Beall (17:05): Overtime, every time. There will be no exceptions to that. There's a certain class of product that is not a superior product that is sort of the mindblowing product where somebody gets it just right. And it resonates in the market. Slack is an example of a mindful product. There were a hundred Slacks, right? There were a thousand Slacks at one point and they happen to get it together just right and "bing" the thing resonated and it spread. And everybody uses those as examples, but when you look at those examples, they apply to a tiny, tiny fraction of the kinds of products that you can feel out there. Almost all products you can feel for the enterprise can't work like Slack in terms of the spread, because the unit of adoption isn't the human.  Dropbox was like this, the unit of adoption was the individual and then they did this thing. Most products, the math doesn't work like that in [inaudible 00:17:58]. The unit of adoption normally is the work group or the department or the division of the company. [crosstalk 00:18:07] And the unit of adoption or unit of change is above the level of the individual, product is essentially, not meaningless, but secondary to go to market strategy. Did I make a list? So, it doesn't get easier and easier or harder and harder?

Today, when you examine the toolbox of the modern sales professional, many of us immediately see the abundance of options in the marketing and sales stacks that decorate most of our desktops…I have tools that can disguise my phone number, I know when someone opens an email, I can do a virtual face to face meeting…AI and machine learning tools even tell me what to say and who I should say it to…a scale of portable technology and advancement and capital on any ordinary rep desktop that would leave an Apollo-era NASA slide-ruled engineer in your dust. But what about the techniques, behaviors, and go to market strategies of that same modern sales professional? Sadly, for most of us, we’re still stranded in mid-century America. But not the mid 20th Century,  rather, I’m speaking of the mid 19th Century America of 33 states. The mid-century of America where the new hot book on the scene was not Good To Great or The Lean Startup, but instead a fresh little nautical fiction text entitled Moby Dick. In this episode, Chris takes us through a virtual time warp of strategy, territories, and compensation as a salesperson. Some things have indeed changed, But some remain firmly entrenched in a midcentury President Franklin Pierce’s America. This is the Market Dominance Guys and today’s episode “Get the DeLorean; My Profession is Stuck in 1855!” ----more---- ---------------------------------------- ConnectAndSell. ConnectAndSell allows your sales reps to talk to more decision-makers in 90 minutes than they would in a week or more of conventional dialing. Your reps can finally be 100% focused on selling since all of their CRM data entry and follow-up scheduling is fully automated within ConnectAndSell’s powerful platform. Your team’s effectiveness will skyrocket by using ConnectAndSell’s teleprompter capability as they’ll know exactly what to say during critical conversations. Visit, <a href="https://ConnectAndSell.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectAndSell.com</a> Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with <a href="https://uncommonpro.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">uncommonpro.com</a>. The complete transcript of this episode is below: Corey Frank (02:42): When we were doing the test drive with you, at Stormwind we had ConnectAndSell, and we were doing pretty well and we're spending lots of money. Tom says we should probably try another competitor just in case. Well, there are no other competitors. Came back with this company called ConnectLeader. Chris Beall (02:57): Oh yeah. Corey Frank (02:57): Oh, okay. Well, sure I kind of felt that yeah, that's the right thing to do for the business. Chris Beall (03:03): Right. Corey Frank (03:03): You know, brought those guys in and you know how the movie ends, right? We probably lasted maybe, gosh, maybe a month with those guys after like three months with you. And then I come crawling back to you and the services, give or take let's just say from Tom's perspective, the services were roughly the same. The biggest difference was the trust factor that I had, because we've probably known each other maybe 10 years before Stormwind and had various interactions. So I did trust you more than I trusted myself. Right? And people like Chad or Steve in the marketplace as well, there are certain folks that I do trust, which is why you seek out their counsel, you seek out their advice. You probably don't set one foot in the AASP Conference in Chicago, you don't even get into the breakout rooms before somebody sees you at the hotel check-in and says, "Oh wait, Chris, I got a quick question about ABC vendor. You're familiar with them." Chris Beall (04:04): I can't physically get into the building, which is great. Corey Frank (04:11): Yeah, because this trust oozes from you, people do trust you. Is that a little bit of that I may have a superior product? I may have even an exceptional list, but if my salespeople are not trained with true empathy and I don't hire to that, that they'll never get to that threshold. Or I may succeed in spite of my sales team, but how conscious should I be as we're going down this path of market dominance in the selection of the people who give that message? Chris Beall (04:46): Hugely careful, this is where hiring somebody who even exaggerates a little bit is highly problematic. I know some who do and get away with it, but they exaggerate transparently. That is, it's a joke. You know, Steve's the opposite. Steve Richard is hyper precise. Steve will never tell you a number that he doesn't know is true. He just won't do it. So there are two personalities out there in the public that take different approaches to it. But when you're hiring a salesperson and you get that person who shades what they say a little bit in order to influence somebody, the problem is that it is the web of lies problem. You can't play it. At some point it just gets problematic. But the other problem is, human beings are to sincerity as wolves are to fear. They smell it, our insincerity, right? Human beings smell insincerity, and the only people that can get away with being insincere in a sales situation are psychopaths. And there are psychopaths out there, sociopath's whatever you want to call them, who actually have perfected the art of causing people to trust them, even though their intentions are very, very bad. Those people exist. They make up a special subset of society they've existed for all time. They have some function out there. I'm sure you can send them in among your enemies. You might get something good to happen. Some of them are in certain industries that are interesting. I would imagine if I were going to be, say a true undercover spy, living in somebody else's society for 40 years, with intent to subvert them, it would probably be pretty handy to be a sociopath or psychopath because then I could get people to trust me because I manufacture it. But for most of us, for the vast, vast majority of people, we're stuck with actually having good intentions, sincerely having good intentions in order to be trusted. And that's a funny place for a sales person to be. In fact, when we compensate salespeople, we're basically saying to them, "you know what, I don't trust you to actually put the effort in and do this correctly so I'm only going to pay you for what you bring in." Everybody else in the company we pay because they do what we asked them to do and we've designed that process. If they do a diligently and they interact with other people in the company, in a way that's helpful, or at least not too hurtful, we keep paying their salaries and unless their job description goes away, they get to stay with us, right? Salespeople, we give them the opposite message. We say, you're an outsider. We're going to pay you as little as possible for doing the job and as much as possible for the results, we don't care how you get the results. We just don't care. Just bring in the number, right? And then we kind of hope that we get sincere people. It used to be, you didn't have to be that sincere to play the scan. So now we have a new situation. It's going to be very interesting to me to see what happens in the world of sales compensation. Sales compensation is based on the notion that sales itself is an external function of the company. Sales is not inside the company, it's outside. It's an appendage, notice where it is on the P and L S G and A sales general and administrative. What, what in the world? We've lumped it in with the electricity that we buy, the rent that we pay. You have to have a sales function, whatever that is right? The sales job was always to convert inventory that was being generated by a factory. So it's the essence of how sales is thought of as an outgrowth of the core structure of capitalism. So capitalism says this, Hey, I got to have capital to make stuff, because you make stuff with machines, right? That's why capitalism was interesting because machines represent the ability to make more than an individual human working with their hands, with the tools they might've accumulated, say were handed from their mom, their dad, right? So if I'm a carpenter in 1600, well, I apprentice to a carpenter, probably my dad. I borrow his tools for a while and then when my dad retires or passes on or cuts his hand off or whatever the hell he does, those tools become mine. And my skills are mine and I take my trade out and I do my trade. Chris Beall (10:04): That's not capitalism. What's the upside of having capital? That would do you no good. In fact, it'd be bad. It would take away the spirit to go out and work. Corey Frank (10:14): Right. Chris Beall (10:14): Idleness, right? I've seen books, very sacred books that talk about how dangerous it is to have [crosstalk 00:10:22]. They're not the right ones, the [inaudible 00:10:25] issues. So there's only so many forms of entertainment. Corey Frank (10:30): Getting pregnant. Chris Beall (10:31): So then we come along and it's like, okay, wait a second, we figured out how to take the stuff of the earth; coal, rain falls uphill and runs downhill. Just a couple of things and turn that stuff into motion. And we figured out how to harness that motion and turn that motion into inputs turning into valuable outputs without a person doing it. And now we say, "Oh, well look at this. I can make cotton gin." Well, what does a cotton gin do? It solves one problem and it creates another problem. The problem is I can run the thing all day long. I can run it all night long. I can do it with two people, one in the day, one in the night, because people need to sleep. That's it, two people doing the job of a hundred people. So now I have this output. I got to dispose of the output. Now I need sales to dispose of the output and turn it into cash. Why do I want the cash? Because the cash is capital to get a new machine and double my productivity, double my production, not my productivity, but my production. So, capitalism produced this beautiful thing, which is a positive feedback loop between the gross profit produced by sales and the future size of my company. Because as long as I have access to the inputs, which is why big companies became vertically integrated, I need my own coal. I need my own iron ore, right? They have integrated supply chains and they did that because interruption of supply would cause your capital to go idle. Your machines would go idle. Sales' job was to keep up with the output and the primary way sales did that was by dynamically adjusting price within individual markets called territories; it was always geographical, in order to make sure that all the output was disposed of. So the reason for the great discounting culture in sales is that the job of sales was to dispose of the output. You can't have inventory buildup forever. You got to sell the stuff off in order to be able to buy the raw materials that you needed to make the stuff in the first place and then in order to be able to potentially expand the business. So sales is still stuck in 1855. Still looks exactly like it did in 1855, which is, I hire you, I give you a territory and you have discounting authority. And you'll only exercise it to a particular degree because your commission depends on how much you sell. So the discipline is provided by the commission. Corey Frank (12:59): And I have extra inventory and I need to get it down to a certain level to keep these machines going and I need a machine [inaudible 00:13:06]. Chris Beall (13:06): It's very simple, right? Why sales exists and why it sits there on SGNA. Why sales doesn't sit, where it should set today, which is right in R and D. Sales is actually a form of development at this point. It's development of the thing you need more than a product, which is a market. The scarcity in the world has gone away from products. You can build products anytime you want. See this product here, this little coffee cup with all of this stuff on it, it's my wife's name and all this cool stuff. I can go on Zazzle and have one of these things made for me. I can have a hundred mate, I can have 10,000 made. And all I do is go click, click, "no I don't want it to say this, I want it to say this. No, I don't want the color to be white I want the color to be beige. No, I don't want that size, I want the handle to look different." Right? Think what that used to take 150 years ago, a hundred years ago, 50 years, 30 years ago. That's huge to make that design decision. We made molds, we have jigs, we have this, we have that. My capital had to be affected. Products are nothing nowadays. Markets are [inaudible 00:14:11]. I was talking to a guy last night about a radical product, a product that will change the world. I can describe it at the very highest levels. It's a product that would allow any owner of any company to know what their company is worth at no cost. Just like you can know what your house is worth through Zillow, you can know what your company is [crosstalk 00:14:34] super valuable product. Anybody can see how valuable it is, right? If you could do that and make the product, you do it. Well, you can do that and make the product. It turns out to build that product, if you have the deep knowledge of that domain, which this individual happens to have, is a matter of calling up [inaudible 00:14:50] and saying, Hey, Tesh would you take a $100,000 to build this for me in six weeks? And he goes, sure, yeah, maybe whatever. I don't know, I'm busy, whatever. Right? So say decides to do it. You're going to get a usable product within six weeks that will change the world. [crosstalk 00:15:06] a marketing problem. Corey Frank (15:08): Right. Chris Beall (15:09): Your product problem has gone down, which is why VCs will no longer fund ideas because the products are so easy to build. They're going, if you bring me an idea, what's wrong with you, why didn't you build the product? So they won't play that game anymore. But the [inaudible 00:15:26], is to go to market game as a demo for a future acquire. But if you're a serious corporate, that is, you're stuck with survival. As a corporation when you get to a certain point, the option of just throwing yourself away, is not so great. If you're a startup, fine, you throw yourself away. You get bought by somebody for whatever the going price is. Everybody's got a formula such and such X revenue, but this category of company, blah, blah, blah, right? But if you're running a hundred million dollar company that you've built up over time, you don't have one market you dominate? Somehow say two of your markets that you used to dominate dissolved through secular forces, they're not there anymore. So you're going to go out of business. It's not an "if" it is a "when". You will go out of business essentially for a simple mathematical reason, someone else will come in and dominate one of your markets that you're playing in. And as you lose share, you'll have to discount like an old fashioned sales guy in order to maintain what feels like share in the market but it actually is going down because the gross profit contribution of each unit that you're selling in that market on a repeated basis is going down and you're hollowing out your company. Corey Frank (16:33): Okay, so if I take this in continuous equation here, superior products, better than average products may not necessarily win in the end if their go to market strategy, their sales staff is not at a superior level. In other words, all of the things being equal in a vacuum, a superior sales force with a substandard product will beat a standard product with a substandard sales force over time, over an extended period of time. Chris Beall (17:05): Overtime, every time. There will be no exceptions to that. There's a certain class of product that is not a superior product that is sort of the mindblowing product where somebody gets it just right. And it resonates in the market. Slack is an example of a mindful product. There were a hundred Slacks, right? There were a thousand Slacks at one point and they happen to get it together just right and "bing" the thing resonated and it spread. And everybody uses those as examples, but when you look at those examples, they apply to a tiny, tiny fraction of the kinds of products that you can feel out there. Almost all products you can feel for the enterprise can't work like Slack in terms of the spread, because the unit of adoption isn't the human. Dropbox was like this, the unit of adoption was the individual and then they did this thing. Most products, the math doesn't work like that in [inaudible 00:17:58]. The unit of adoption normally is the work group or the department or the division of the company. [crosstalk 00:18:07] And the unit of adoption or unit of change is above the level of the individual, product is essentially, not meaningless, but secondary to go to market strategy. Did I make a list? So, it doesn't get easier and easier or harder and harder?

EP12: Get the DeLorean; My Profession is Stuck in 1855.

Explaining the decision to employ the newly developed and yet far-from-perfect radar system used to protect England from the stifling Nazi blitz in World War II, the esteemed scientist Robert Alexander Watson-Watt said, “Always strive to  give the military the third-best because the best is impossible and second best is always too late.” This attitude of being good enough, and not perfect, has been dubbed ‘the cult of the imperfect.’ The French philosopher Voltaire summed this attitude nearly two hundred years earlier when he wrote, “The best is the enemy of the good.” Certainly, when creating a call campaign or lead list, trying for perfection in our initial query is also very much our enemy. In this episode of Market Dominance Guys, Chris explains why what you are doing when you create a list is already wrong! This is Market List Creation…Know your enemy! ----more---- ConnectAndSell – welcome to the end of dialing as you know it! Give your fingers a rest. With ConnectAndSell’s Patented Technology, you’ll load your Best Sales folks up with 8-10x More Live qualified Conversations every day… and when we say qualified, we’re talking about really Qualified… like knowing how many tears they shed while watching the end of Toy Story - kind of qualified. Visit ConnectandSell.com Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with uncommonpro.com.   The complete transcript of this episode is below: Your advice then if I may, we have a hypothetical software company that it's an HR persona software that helps me identify unhappy employees and it calls their social media and their credit score and their kid's college tuition and puts this all into an algorithm that spits out a score that says, "Even though Chris Beall is a good employee today, he has all these external pressures, positive or negative, that would make him an unhappy employee." Let's just say we have a product like that.  And I want to focus on certain people in a company. The traditional way is to say, "Hey, listen, this fits HR people in an organization." What I hear you saying is, "It's more or less of who has the most, where is a potential area of pain from an organization that is suffering from turnover that needs to stem that turnover or that the cost of acquisition is so high in getting an employee that you want to make sure that when they find an employee, they keep that employee." And so as I'm going through this thought process of creating this list for this fictitious HR software company, what are some of the steps I should think about when I create my list from how most people do it, to how it should be done? Because I have a product that fits every HR person in America and every organization that has employees should care about this product, because you don't want those employees to leave. Chris Beall (03:43): So the trick to all of this is actually pretty simple. It is first to recognize that it's a hypothesis. Your list is a hypothesis about the market. It's not the definition of a market. And as a hypothesis, it's worth about as much effort and time that it would take to come up with a hypothesis for, gosh, I wonder if this pork chop would taste better with more salt on it? Really, you don't want to sit around for four or five days thinking about this, arguing about it. So thing number one is, cut it with the internal meetings that are full of everybody's opinions. All you're going to do is reduce the darn thing to a list anyway. Until you're actually talking to folks you don't know very much, get a cycle time for building a list down to as fast as possible because the cycle time to discovering if the list is any good is about a week. Done right, it's about a week.  So don't spend five weeks talking about something that's going to take one week to determine if it made any sense, because I guarantee you you're wrong. So you missed, number one, admit you're wrong in advance, and then be bold in your hypothesis. Second, be very, very specific. So whatever your hypothesis is, don't hedge within the hypothesis. The goal isn't to see whether you can settle at a meeting. The goal is to see whether you'll learn something from having set those meetings. So be specific. Target a role, target an industry. If you're really in a frisky mood, target a geography for a funny reason, which is there are always differences in geographies that are not manifested in the data. Corey Frank (05:19): Really? Chris Beall (05:20): All of it, everything in the world has got local influences. It's like in every business there's seasonality, but until you've run it for two years, you don't know what the seasonality is. Corey Frank (05:31): So for instance, if we had this hypothetical HR software, obviously where there's a high amount of employees moving back and forth for attrition. I tested in the SFO Palo Alto area, and I may get a different result of the same product in Mission, Kansas, where there's only four big employers and people work at these organizations for 10, 15, 20 years. And so if I would validate it in Mission, Kansas versus SFO, I would potentially get some false positives if I never tested it outside of a particular geo. Chris Beall (06:10): Exactly, exactly. It's always good to be more specific, if there's enough volume to support the experiment. Unfortunately, these experiments don't take that much volume, the smaller this debt that you're going, if you think, okay, it's possible that the San Francisco Bay area is a market for us. That means it's self-referencing. And that's a great example you gave because that's a great example of companies that share a bond, a background that you wouldn't have elsewhere. They share the same venture capitalists, the same board members, and they're under very similar pressure. So I would go as specific as you're going to go to the SaaS companies in the Bay area that are funded, they have to be funded, maybe even going to the ones that are series B and beyond because they have this particular talent management problem, in my head. And I just go over to some combination of ZoomInfo and LinkedIn Sales Navigator.  And maybe if I'm really looking for funding information, CB insights, I make my list. How long does it take to make that list? 15 minutes, 20 minutes, not very hard. I put in some criteria, then I inspect the list. How do I inspect the list? Well, list-making always brings false positives in terms of titles, mapping personas to titles is very, very hard. Don't worry about it. Make the list with a broader set of keywords, because that's all you really have to work with or concepts and attributes. As you know, this used to be my business at one point in my life was the world of catalogs, all that kind of detail in them. Don't worry about it too much. Just make sure your list has false positives in it. Then pull the list into Excel, pivot the list on title, sort descending, that's from the biggest, the highest count to the lowest count, on the counts of the titles.  And there are two things you're looking for. One is you want the title with the biggest count to be a drop dead obvious, this is who I want in the list. And you want titles that have high counts that are obviously not possibilities. The classic case, I'm looking for CEOs and I got assistants to CEOs. Corey Frank (08:15): Yes. Chris Beall (08:16): Well, I pivot the list and now I've aggregated the assistant to CEO titles with a number next to them, there's 22 of these, 11 of these and sort. I just strike those as a chunk. And then I got my list. It's a very simple two-step process. And even with the big list, a list of say 5,000, it takes about another 15 to 20 minutes to go and pivot the list and say, "Oh, there's a title that I never want. And there's too many of them." If there's a title you never want, and there's not very many of them, below some level of count, just ignore it, go ahead and call them and talk to them. You might learn something. Now you've got a list. That's it. Corey Frank (08:50): That should take about a week to run through with the proper support mechanism, the proper technology. I should be able to use that week cycle to validate to vet out the success of that list. And we can talk about next time since we're up against the clock here, talk about what is the definition of success, whether this list should continue or whether we should pivot, change the selects and go with a different list. And then AB tested week to week before we quote unquote scale or get a larger list. Chris Beall (09:23): Exactly. Actually what we're going to pivot on is the message first. The message is more nimble than the list. And we always modify the design based on the cycle time of getting to a new design. So the new design is a new message, which is a new product remembering that our original problem was not to find the people, they're always out there.  The companies are always out there, but to find a product. It's a search process looking for a product, and we're going to look for the product that resonates in a list. Once we do that, we lock down on the list and we lock down the message, we expand it, and we immediately go to scale. I'm hearing you say, Chris, they're just so overly rigid in their messaging and what they perceive as their market, after maybe a cycle or two, either in seed round or early A round where they never come off of that and then they just throw boatloads of money at trying to fit the square peg in this round hole. And I think that's what we can talk a little bit about next time here, since we're up against the clock.

Explaining the decision to employ the newly developed and yet far-from-perfect radar system used to protect England from the stifling Nazi blitz in World War II, the esteemed scientist Robert Alexander Watson-Watt said, “Always strive to  give the military the third-best because the best is impossible and second best is always too late.” This attitude of being good enough, and not perfect, has been dubbed ‘the cult of the imperfect.’ The French philosopher Voltaire summed this attitude nearly two hundred years earlier when he wrote, “The best is the enemy of the good.” Certainly, when creating a call campaign or lead list, trying for perfection in our initial query is also very much our enemy. In this episode of Market Dominance Guys, Chris explains why what you are doing when you create a list is already wrong! This is Market List Creation…Know your enemy! ----more---- ConnectAndSell – welcome to the end of dialing as you know it! Give your fingers a rest. With ConnectAndSell’s Patented Technology, you’ll load your Best Sales folks up with 8-10x More Live qualified Conversations every day… and when we say qualified, we’re talking about really Qualified… like knowing how many tears they shed while watching the end of Toy Story - kind of qualified. Visit <a href="https://ConnectandSell.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">ConnectandSell.com</a> Uncommon Pro - Selling a big idea to a skeptical customer, investor, or partner is one of the hardest jobs in business, so when it’s time to really Go Big, you need to use an Uncommon methodology to gain attention, frame your thoughts, and employ a sequencing that is familiar to convince others that your ideas will truly change their world. Through Uncommon Pro’s modern and innovative sales, scripting, and coaching toolset, we offer a guiding hand to ambitious Sales Leaders and their determined teams in their quest to reach market dominance. Today is the day things change. It’s time to get “uncommon” with <a href="https://uncommonpro.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">uncommonpro.com</a>.  The complete transcript of this episode is below: Your advice then if I may, we have a hypothetical software company that it's an HR persona software that helps me identify unhappy employees and it calls their social media and their credit score and their kid's college tuition and puts this all into an algorithm that spits out a score that says, "Even though Chris Beall is a good employee today, he has all these external pressures, positive or negative, that would make him an unhappy employee." Let's just say we have a product like that. And I want to focus on certain people in a company. The traditional way is to say, "Hey, listen, this fits HR people in an organization." What I hear you saying is, "It's more or less of who has the most, where is a potential area of pain from an organization that is suffering from turnover that needs to stem that turnover or that the cost of acquisition is so high in getting an employee that you want to make sure that when they find an employee, they keep that employee." And so as I'm going through this thought process of creating this list for this fictitious HR software company, what are some of the steps I should think about when I create my list from how most people do it, to how it should be done? Because I have a product that fits every HR person in America and every organization that has employees should care about this product, because you don't want those employees to leave. Chris Beall (03:43): So the trick to all of this is actually pretty simple. It is first to recognize that it's a hypothesis. Your list is a hypothesis about the market. It's not the definition of a market. And as a hypothesis, it's worth about as much effort and time that it would take to come up with a hypothesis for, gosh, I wonder if this pork chop would taste better with more salt on it? Really, you don't want to sit around for four or five days thinking about this, arguing about it. So thing number one is, cut it with the internal meetings that are full of everybody's opinions. All you're going to do is reduce the darn thing to a list anyway. Until you're actually talking to folks you don't know very much, get a cycle time for building a list down to as fast as possible because the cycle time to discovering if the list is any good is about a week. Done right, it's about a week. So don't spend five weeks talking about something that's going to take one week to determine if it made any sense, because I guarantee you you're wrong. So you missed, number one, admit you're wrong in advance, and then be bold in your hypothesis. Second, be very, very specific. So whatever your hypothesis is, don't hedge within the hypothesis. The goal isn't to see whether you can settle at a meeting. The goal is to see whether you'll learn something from having set those meetings. So be specific. Target a role, target an industry. If you're really in a frisky mood, target a geography for a funny reason, which is there are always differences in geographies that are not manifested in the data. Corey Frank (05:19): Really? Chris Beall (05:20): All of it, everything in the world has got local influences. It's like in every business there's seasonality, but until you've run it for two years, you don't know what the seasonality is. Corey Frank (05:31): So for instance, if we had this hypothetical HR software, obviously where there's a high amount of employees moving back and forth for attrition. I tested in the SFO Palo Alto area, and I may get a different result of the same product in Mission, Kansas, where there's only four big employers and people work at these organizations for 10, 15, 20 years. And so if I would validate it in Mission, Kansas versus SFO, I would potentially get some false positives if I never tested it outside of a particular geo. Chris Beall (06:10): Exactly, exactly. It's always good to be more specific, if there's enough volume to support the experiment. Unfortunately, these experiments don't take that much volume, the smaller this debt that you're going, if you think, okay, it's possible that the San Francisco Bay area is a market for us. That means it's self-referencing. And that's a great example you gave because that's a great example of companies that share a bond, a background that you wouldn't have elsewhere. They share the same venture capitalists, the same board members, and they're under very similar pressure. So I would go as specific as you're going to go to the SaaS companies in the Bay area that are funded, they have to be funded, maybe even going to the ones that are series B and beyond because they have this particular talent management problem, in my head. And I just go over to some combination of ZoomInfo and LinkedIn Sales Navigator. And maybe if I'm really looking for funding information, CB insights, I make my list. How long does it take to make that list? 15 minutes, 20 minutes, not very hard. I put in some criteria, then I inspect the list. How do I inspect the list? Well, list-making always brings false positives in terms of titles, mapping personas to titles is very, very hard. Don't worry about it. Make the list with a broader set of keywords, because that's all you really have to work with or concepts and attributes. As you know, this used to be my business at one point in my life was the world of catalogs, all that kind of detail in them. Don't worry about it too much. Just make sure your list has false positives in it. Then pull the list into Excel, pivot the list on title, sort descending, that's from the biggest, the highest count to the lowest count, on the counts of the titles. And there are two things you're looking for. One is you want the title with the biggest count to be a drop dead obvious, this is who I want in the list. And you want titles that have high counts that are obviously not possibilities. The classic case, I'm looking for CEOs and I got assistants to CEOs. Corey Frank (08:15): Yes. Chris Beall (08:16): Well, I pivot the list and now I've aggregated the assistant to CEO titles with a number next to them, there's 22 of these, 11 of these and sort. I just strike those as a chunk. And then I got my list. It's a very simple two-step process. And even with the big list, a list of say 5,000, it takes about another 15 to 20 minutes to go and pivot the list and say, "Oh, there's a title that I never want. And there's too many of them." If there's a title you never want, and there's not very many of them, below some level of count, just ignore it, go ahead and call them and talk to them. You might learn something. Now you've got a list. That's it. Corey Frank (08:50): That should take about a week to run through with the proper support mechanism, the proper technology. I should be able to use that week cycle to validate to vet out the success of that list. And we can talk about next time since we're up against the clock here, talk about what is the definition of success, whether this list should continue or whether we should pivot, change the selects and go with a different list. And then AB tested week to week before we quote unquote scale or get a larger list. Chris Beall (09:23): Exactly. Actually what we're going to pivot on is the message first. The message is more nimble than the list. And we always modify the design based on the cycle time of getting to a new design. So the new design is a new message, which is a new product remembering that our original problem was not to find the people, they're always out there. The companies are always out there, but to find a product. It's a search process looking for a product, and we're going to look for the product that resonates in a list. Once we do that, we lock down on the list and we lock down the message, we expand it, and we immediately go to scale. I'm hearing you say, Chris, they're just so overly rigid in their messaging and what they perceive as their market, after maybe a cycle or two, either in seed round or early A round where they never come off of that and then they just throw boatloads of money at trying to fit the square peg in this round hole. And I think that's what we can talk a little bit about next time here, since we're up against the clock.

EP5: Market List Creation - Know Your Enemy.

EP4: Messaging Eats Product for Breakfast

EP24: Would it Help if I Perform a Haka Before My Cold Calls?

EP18: Surf’s Up - We All Stand Equal Before a Wave.

EP21: The First Law of Sales Holes - If You Find Yourself in One, Stop Digging.

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