#95 - Kelly Wanser on whether to deliberately intervene in the climate
80,000 Hours Podcast with Rob Wiblin
How long do you think it'll be before we're able to bend the weather to our will? A massive rainmaking program in China, efforts to seed new oases in the Arabian peninsula, or chemically induce snow for skiers in Colorado. 100 years? 50 years? 20? Those who know how to write a teaser hook for a podcast episode will have correctly guessed that all these things are already happening today. And the techniques being used could be turned to managing climate change as well. Today's guest, Kelly Wanser, founded SilverLining - a nonprofit organization that advocates research into climate interventions, such as seeding or brightening clouds, to ensure that we maintain a safe climate. Links to learn more, summary and full transcript. Kelly says that current climate projections, even if we do everything right from here on out, imply that two degrees of global warming are now unavoidable. And the same scientists who made those projections fear the flow-through effect that warming could have. Since our best case scenario may already be too dangerous, SilverLining focuses on ways that we could intervene quickly in the climate if things get especially grim - their research serving as a kind of insurance policy. After considering everything from mirrors in space, to shiny objects on the ocean, to materials on the Arctic, their scientists concluded that the most promising approach was leveraging one of the ways that the Earth already regulates its temperature - the reflection of sunlight off particles and clouds in the atmosphere. Cloud brightening is a climate control approach that uses the spraying of a fine mist of sea water into clouds to make them 'whiter' so they reflect even more sunlight back into space. These 'streaks' in clouds are already created by ships because the particulates from their diesel engines inadvertently make clouds a bit brighter. Kelly says that scientists estimate that we're already lowering the global temperature this way by 0.5?1.1ºC, without even intending to. While fossil fuel particulates are terrible for human health, they think we could replicate this effect by simply spraying sea water up into clouds. But so far there hasn't been funding to measure how much temperature change you get for a given amount of spray. And we won't want to dive into these methods head first because the atmosphere is a complex system we can't yet properly model, and there are many things to check first. For instance, chemicals that reflect light from the upper atmosphere might totally change wind patterns in the stratosphere. Or they might not - for all the discussion of global warming the climate is surprisingly understudied. The public tends to be skeptical of climate interventions, otherwise known as geoengineering, so in this episode we cover a range of possible objections, such as: * It being riskier than doing nothing * That it will inevitably be dangerously political * And the risk of the 'double catastrophe', where a pandemic stops our climate interventions and temperatures sky-rocket at the worst time. Kelly and Rob also talk about: * The many climate interventions that are already happening * The most promising ideas in the field * And whether people would be more accepting if we found ways to intervene that had nothing to do with making the world a better place. Producer: Keiran Harris. Audio mastering: Ben Cordell. Transcriptions: Sofia Davis-Fogel.
Kelly Wanser on Climate Change as a Possible Existential Threat
Future of Life Institute Podcast
Kelly Wanser from SilverLining joins us to discuss techniques for climate intervention to mitigate the impacts of human induced climate change. Topics discussed in this episode include:- The risks of climate change in the short-term- Tipping points and tipping cascades- Climate intervention via marine cloud brightening and releasing particles in the stratosphere- The benefits and risks of climate intervention techniques - The international politics of climate change and weather modificationYou can find the page for this podcast here: https://futureoflife.org/2020/09/30/kelly-wanser-on-marine-cloud-brightening-for-mitigating-climate-change/Video recording of this podcast here: https://youtu.be/CEUEFUkSMHUTimestamps: 0:00 Intro2:30 What is SilverLining’s mission? 4:27 Why is climate change thought to be very risky in the next 10-30 years? 8:40 Tipping points and tipping cascades13:25 Is climate change an existential risk? 17:39 Earth systems that help to stabilize the climate 21:23 Days where it will be unsafe to work outside 25:03 Marine cloud brightening, stratospheric sunlight reflection, and other climate interventions SilverLining is interested in 41:46 What experiments are happening to understand tropospheric and stratospheric climate interventions? 50:20 International politics of weather modification 53:52 How do efforts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions fit into the project of reflecting sunlight? 57:35 How would you respond to someone who views climate intervention by marine cloud brightening as too dangerous? 59:33 What are the main points of persons skeptical of climate intervention approaches 01:13:21 The international problem of coordinating on climate change 01:24:50 Is climate change a global catastrophic or existential risk, and how does it relate to other large risks?01:33:20 Should effective altruists spend more time on the issue of climate change and climate intervention? 01:37:48 What can listeners do to help with this issue? 01:40:00 Climate change and mars colonization 01:44:55 Where to find and follow KellyThis podcast is possible because of the support of listeners like you. If you found this conversation to be meaningful or valuable, consider supporting it directly by donating at futureoflife.org/donate. Contributions like yours make these conversations possible.
Is Reflecting Sunlight from the Atmosphere a Bridge to the Future?: Kelly Wanser
Long Now: Conversations at The Interval
Recent data shows damage from climate change rapidly increasing. There are many scientifically proposed methods (from the U.S. National Academy of Sciences, the U.K. Royal Society, and the American Geophysical Union among others) for directly reducing atmospheric heat. Yet to date there are still no formal research programs or capabilities to further explore these geoengineering ideas. What are the potential risks and benefits? How do we balance this effort vs. emissions reduction and restoring the natural system? Kelly Wanser of SilverLining discusses her work advocating, educating and coordinating research on this important effort to combat climate change. Kelly Wanser, as Executive Director of SilverLining, helps drive research that will ensure safe pathways for climate for people and ecosystems within the coming decade. She works to accelerate adoption of technologies that help us understand and manage climate as a complex systems problem. Ms. Wanser works closely with leading scientists, engineers, technologists and government leaders on efforts to increase research and accelerate progress on reducing atmospheric heat. She testified before the U.S. House Space, Science and Technology Committee as part of a panel on "Geoengineering: Innovation, Research, and Technology." She serves as Board Director for BioCarbon Engineering, who use drone and AI technology to help restore ecosystems, and is a Senior Advisor to BlackBirch, whose hyper-local data helps companies manage weather risk.
Ep 50: Kelly Wanser, Executive Director at SilverLining
My Climate Journey
Today’s guest is Kelly Wanser, Executive Director of SilverLining, a mission organization driving research to ensure safe pathways for climate within a decade.Previously, Kelly was the director of the Marine Cloud Brightening Project, a program focused on research in reflecting sunlight to reduce heat in climate. Kelly is member of the National Academy of Sciences President’s Circle. She also served as Senior Advisor to Ocean Conservancy on climate-ocean risk and to Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory on industry strategy for fusion energy. A technologist, executive and entrepreneur, she previously founded companies in IT infrastructure, analytics and security, and is the author of over 20 patents. She resides in San Francisco.In today’s episode, we cover:Overview of geoengineeringChallenge of predicting earth system’s response to heat stress and risk of hitting catastrophic tipping points'The case for geoengineeringSilverLining’s work, and how it came to beWhat the critics say about geoengineering, and Kelly’s responses'Some example projects they have taken on at SilverLining'How the org is funded, and future goals in this regardWhat fossil fuel companies think of geoengineeringPotential risks, side effects, and unintended consequencesResearch vs widescale deployment, the best ways to stage exploration in this areaWhat else can be impactful in the climate fightKelly’s advice to others trying to find their lane to helpLinks to topics discussed in this episode:Stephen Schneider: https://stephenschneider.stanford.edu/References/Biography.htmlIPCC special report on oceans and cryosphere: https://www.ipcc.ch/srocc/home/The Royal Society: https://royalsociety.org/Marine cloud brightening: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_cloud_brighteningStrategic aerosol injection: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratospheric_aerosol_injectionSome links provided by Kelly to learn more about her work:TEDSummit 2019 Talk: Emergency Medicine for Our Climate FeverReport: for U.S. Policymakers: Ensuring a Safe Climate: A National Imperative for Research in Climate Intervention and Earth System PredictionTestimony to the U.S. House Science, Space and Technology Committee, Subcommittee on Environment and Subcommittee on Energy Hearing — Geoengineering: Innovation, Research, and Technology, Nov 8, 2017You can find me on twitter @jjacobs22 or @mcjpod and email at email@example.com, where I encourage you to share your feedback on episodes and suggestions for future topics or guests.Enjoy the show!
우리가 온실가스를 대기로 배출함으로써 지구의 온난화를 무자비하게 가중시키고 있는 동안, 산업용 배기가스 배출은 태양 빛을 우주로 다시 반사해보내는 입자를 생산하고 있고, 그것은 우리가 이제 겨우 이해하기 시작한 지구 온난화를 억제합니다. 기후변화 운동가인 켈리 왠저는 우리에게 묻습니다. 우리가 이러한 효과를 활용하여 온난화를 감소시킬 수 있는 방법을 고안할 수 있을까요? "구름 표백"의 가능성과 위험성에 대해서 알아보고, 그것이 우리 기후를 다시 건강하게 복구시키는데 어떻게 도움이 될지도 알아봅시다.
Medicina urgente para la fiebre climática | Kelly Wanser
TEDTalks Ciencia y Medicina
Conforme calentamos el planeta de forma imprudente por culpa de los gases de efecto invernadero, algunas de las emisiones industriales producen partículas que reflejan los rayos del sol, lo que provoca que sepamos aún menos de lo que creíamos sobre el calentamiento global. La activista por el clima Kelly Wanser se pregunta: ¿podemos ingeniar formas de aprovechar este efecto y reducir aún más el calentamiento? Infórmate sobre las ventajas y los riesgos del "abrillantamiento de nubes" (y sobre cómo podría ayudar a devolverle la salud al clima).
Medicamento de emergência para a febre do nosso clima | Kelly Wanser
TEDTalks Ciência e Medicina
Enquanto nós imprudentemente aquecemos o planeta com a liberação de gases de efeito estufa na atmosfera, algumas das emissões industriais também produzem partículas que refletem luz solar de volta para o espaço, criando uma grande dúvida na questão do aquecimento global. A ativista do clima, Kelly Wanser, nos pergunta: "Podemos criar maneiras de conseguir esse efeito e ainda diminuir o aquecimento?" Saiba mais sobre as promessas e riscos do clareamento das nuvens, e como ele poderá nos ajudar a restaurar a saúde do nosso clima.
Emergency medicine for our climate fever | Kelly Wanser
TED Talks Science and Medicine
As we recklessly warm the planet by pumping greenhouse gases into the atmosphere, some industrial emissions also produce particles that reflect sunshine back into space, putting a check on global warming that we're only starting to understand. Climate activist Kelly Wanser asks: Can we engineer ways to harness this effect and further reduce warming? Learn more about the promises and risks of "cloud brightening" -- and how it could help restore our climate to health.
Un traitement d'urgence pour notre fièvre climatique | Kelly Wanser
TEDTalks Science et médecine
Si nous réchauffons imprudemment la planète en libérant des gaz à effet de serre dans l'atmosphère, certaines émissions industrielles produisent également des particules qui réfléchissent la lumière du soleil et la renvoient dans l'espace. Cela freine le réchauffement climatique, que l'on commence à comprendre seulement maintenant. L'activiste pour le climat Kelly Wanser pose la question suivante : Pouvons-nous concevoir des méthodes permettant d'exploiter ce phénomène pour réduire davantage le réchauffement ? Découvrez les promesses et les risques de « l'éclaircissement des nuages » et comment il pourrait aider à soigner notre climat.
#28 Technology and Climate Change - The Next Frontier - Kelly Wanser
Momenta I Digital Thread
Kelly Wanser is a technologist and entrepreneur, Executive Director of SilverLining, a not for profit climate research organization. Previously she was Principle Director of the The Marine Cloud Brightening Project, a program focused on research in reflecting sunlight to reduce heat in climate. She also sits on the Board of Directors for BioCarbon Engineering. Our conversation focused on the application of technology to address the challenges of climate change, and how the initiatives she works with are looking to expand on research in the public sector. Kelly is an articulate advocate of the imperative to marshal the resources of Silicon Valley’s tech innovators to address the pressing global issues of our era.